[XML-DEV Mailing List Archive Home] [By Thread] [By Date] [Recent Entries] [Reply To This Message]

Re: Edi complexity, does ebxml really reduce it?

php edi
Thanks, i actually found a paper by you on the subject via google,  your  link
#2 looks especially promising. 

Quoting Sacha Schlegel <sacha_ml@s...>:

> Hi Bry
> See my comments below.
> On Tue, 2004-07-13 at 10:52 +0200, bry@i... wrote:
> > 
> >  Whenever one examines one of the ebxml specs or reads an article on the
> subject
> >  there is likely to be a reference to how edi had problems with being
> accepted
> > because it was too complex, but luckily ebxml, being based on xml, solves
> all
> > this. A very suspect class of assertion it seems like to me. I'm wondering
> if
> > anyone who has familiarity with these technologies can clarify exactly how
> and
> > in what ways ebxml reduces the complexity of edi. 
> > 
> > Basically my understanding is that ebxml just wrapped the edi model in xml,
> so I
> > have a hard time seeing how it could be simpler. 
> > 
> > Also am wondering about CPAs in Ebxml, it strikes me that this process
> could
> > actually be somewhat onerous, does anyone know of any case studies etc.
> on
> > problems with making CPAs between two companies?
> > 
> In my research (masters degree) I am/was looking at the "ebXML
> Collaboration Protocol Agreement formation process".
> This is the process to get from two ebXML Collaboration Protocol
> Profiles (CPP) to a Collaboration Protocol Agreement (CPA).
> This process can be divided into 2 subporcesses:
> 1) The CPA (template) composition
> 2) The CPA negotiation
> Some more comments on these two processes:
> 1) CPA composition
> ------------------
> The algorithmic CPA composition process is described in the ebXML CPPA
> Specification in Appendix E. Basically a tool reads two CPPs and checks
> their XML elements and attributes to make sure they match. Matching
> elements and attributes go into a new CPA template. Problematic elements
> and attributes go into a gap list (a problem or conflict list).
> So this algorithm can check two CPP's pretty good and finds
> inconsitencies in the two input documents. The CPP describes how a ebXML
> Business process for example is technically realised. For example the
> CPA composition algorithm has to check if the selected transport
> protocol of the two CPP's is the same, that the version of the transport
> protocol is the same etc. Also such an algorithm has to check that one
> party sends a business document and that the other side can receive that
> business document.
> One important part is the business process which is referenced in the
> two CPP's. Bascially if they reference a different business process the
> two CPP's are incompatible. There is/was a research project "Matching of
> ebXML Business Processes" from Dennis Krukkert, Version 0.31, Status: In
> Progress which tried to look at two different business process and to
> evaluate if even two different business process are somewhat compatible
> (some comments here[1]).
> Concerning the gap list ... these are conflicts which most likely have
> to be solved by a phone call, or meeting. So no full automation here,
> BUT a way to look at 2 CPP's and create a CPA template and a gap list.
> So this is a start.
> 2) CPA negotiation
> ------------------
> There is a subcommittee of the OASIS CPPA technical committee looking at
> the automated negotiation of a CPA. The "Automated Negotiation of CPA"
> specification of that subcommittee has version 0.10 (so still early
> stage).
> This specification introduces the CPA negotiation. Each CPP has already
> a limited set of negotiation capabilites, such as listing alternatives.
> Eg. one party can list several supported ways to deliver documments but
> in the end (in the CPA) two parties select only ONE way to deliver
> documents.
> This specification introduces Negotion Description Document (NDD) which
> are associated with a CPP or a CPA template. An NDD lists elements and
> attributes of a CPP or CPA template which can be negotiated. In the CPA
> composition process these new NDD docuemnts are included to maybe find a
> solution of problems that would go into the gap list otherwise. The CPA
> composition tool will have to merge the two NDD's of the input CPP's to
> a NDD for the CPA template.
> This specfication does further introduce the CPA negotiation. In the CPA
> negotiation one party sends a CPA template (from the CPA composition
> tool) as well as the NDD associated with that CPA template to the other
> party. This is called the "initial CPA offer". The second party then has
> 3 options: 
> o reject intitial offer (results in a failure of the negotiation)
> o accept intitial offer (if there are no open issues the CPA template
> will become the final CPA)
> o send a counter offer.
> The two party's can send counter offers back and forth until, hopefully,
> they reach a final CPA.
> Please remember that the CPA negotiation is a negotiation on a technical
> level (we use http version 1.1 as transport protocol) and not on a
> business level (eg if you buy within 5 days you get 10% discount).
> This negotiation process is itself a collaborative business process and
> is described as an ebXML collaborative business process. The
> sepcification does provide the ebXML Business Process XML instance
> (negotiation business process), a CPA Skeleton, the structure of
> negotiation messages, the negotiation protocol and negotiation rules.
> Actually the specification DOES provide the infrastructure to negotiated
> a CPA. Unfortunately the specification DOES NOT provide negotiation
> algorithms or negotiation strategies how to actully negotiate over those
> elements and attributes listed in the NDD. 
> Thoes negotiation algorithms and strategies have to be provided by
> implementors. More input and research in this area is necessary.
> Knowledge from the negotiation filed of Artificial Intelligence and Game
> Theory should be evaluated and/or applied.
> Summary:
> --------
> It is possible to algorithmically create a CPA from two CPP's. The
> completness of the resulting CPA is based on the quality of the CPA
> composition tool and the complexity of the input CPP's.
> The CPA negotiation will allow parties (or their negotiation systems) to
> negotiate a CPA but more work and experience is necessary to get this
> happen.
> The final thesis of the research is not out yet but the research is
> done. Please find more info at [2]
> Kind regards.
> Sacha Schlegel
> [1]
> [2] http://www.schlegel.li/ebXML
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > -----------------------------------------------------------------
> > The xml-dev list is sponsored by XML.org <http://www.xml.org>, an
> > initiative of OASIS <http://www.oasis-open.org>
> > 
> > The list archives are at http://lists.xml.org/archives/xml-dev/
> > 
> > To subscribe or unsubscribe from this list use the subscription
> > manager: <http://www.oasis-open.org/mlmanage/index.php>
> > 
> -----------------------------------------------------------------
> The xml-dev list is sponsored by XML.org <http://www.xml.org>, an
> initiative of OASIS <http://www.oasis-open.org>
> The list archives are at http://lists.xml.org/archives/xml-dev/
> To subscribe or unsubscribe from this list use the subscription
> manager: <http://www.oasis-open.org/mlmanage/index.php>


Purchasing Stylus Studio from our online shop is Easy, Secure and Value Priced!

Buy Stylus Studio Now

Download The World's Best XML IDE!

Accelerate XML development with our award-winning XML IDE - Download a free trial today!

Don't miss another message! Subscribe to this list today.
First Name
Last Name
Subscribe in XML format
RSS 2.0
Atom 0.3

Stylus Studio has published XML-DEV in RSS and ATOM formats, enabling users to easily subcribe to the list from their preferred news reader application.

Stylus Studio Sponsored Links are added links designed to provide related and additional information to the visitors of this website. they were not included by the author in the initial post. To view the content without the Sponsor Links please click here.

Site Map | Privacy Policy | Terms of Use | Trademarks
Free Stylus Studio XML Training:
W3C Member
Stylus Studio® and DataDirect XQuery ™are products from DataDirect Technologies, is a registered trademark of Progress Software Corporation, in the U.S. and other countries. © 2004-2013 All Rights Reserved.