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Re: When you create a markup language, what do your parent ele

• From: Jim Melton <jim.melton@oracle.com>
• To: liam@w3.org
• Date: Thu, 29 Sep 2011 13:29:22 -0600

Further to the use of XML parent and child elements for 
representation of documents, I'm surprised that nobody has used the 
following example:

<paragraph>This is a sample paragraph that has some <emphasis 
kind="italics">text markup</emphasis> embedded within 
it.  <quote>This is a common situation</quote>, said the author.</paragraph>

In that XML example, the <paragraph> element has five 
children.  Three of those children are text nodes (which are not, of 
course, elements or attributes).  Two of the children are elements, 
each of which has a single child (a text node).  One of those element 
children has an attribute that, in this case, specifies something 
about the element itself.

I don't think that anybody could reasonably claim that the <emphasis> 
child element has any definitive relationship to the <paragraph> 
element other than simple containment.  As Liam suggested, this is an 
example of a parent-child relationship that has nothing to do with a 
"has-a" relationship.  That is, <emphasis> is not a property of the 
object <paragraph> (and I find referring to <paragraph> as an 
"object" not all that helpful anyway, although it's certainly not 
"wrong" to do so).

Hope this helps,
    Jim


At 9/28/2011 08:09 PM, Liam R E Quin wrote:
>On Mon, 2011-09-26 at 08:54 -0400, Costello, Roger L. wrote:
> > Hi Folks,
> >
> > How do you define a parent element and its children?
>
> > Recap: here are two ways of defining the meaning of markup:
> >
> > 1. Object-property
> > 2. Functional definition
> >
> > What other ways are there?
>
>What is this thing called "meaning" of which you speak?
>
>One fundamental difference between GML and XSLT is that GML is a
>modeling language. Other XML vocabulary types include transcription
>languages (TEI), document-writing languages (docbook, mallard),
>event-logs (HTTP access, bird-watching reports), constraint languages,
>graphical languages, formatting languages, XML-based protocols (xmlrpc,
>SOAP, WDT [1]) and much more.
>
>Some languages use the parent-child relationship to signify something
>beyond parent-child or "has-a" and some do not.  My feeling is that most
>do not, in fact.
>
>Similarly, followed-by can be significant, and often is, but also often
>is not. War and Peace is a lot to read in any order, but makes most
>sense in original document order. Dhalgren makes no sense in any
>order :-)
>
>XSLT uses lexical containment (parent-child) as a scoped block; a
>graphical language might use containment as an implicit clipping or
>grouping.
>
>There's no general rule.
>
>Liam
>
>[1] "SOAP - Where's The Dirt?"
>
>--
>Liam Quin - XML Activity Lead, W3C, http://www.w3.org/People/Quin/
>Pictures from old books: http://fromoldbooks.org/
>Ankh: irc.sorcery.net irc.gnome.org www.advogato.org

========================================================================
Jim Melton --- Editor of ISO/IEC 9075-* (SQL)     Phone: +1.801.942.0144
   Chair, ISO/IEC JTC1/SC32 and W3C XML Query WG    Fax : +1.801.942.3345
Oracle Corporation        Oracle Email: jim dot melton at oracle dot com
1930 Viscounti Drive      Alternate email: jim dot melton at acm dot org
Sandy, UT 84093-1063 USA  Personal email: SheltieJim at xmission dot com
========================================================================
=  Facts are facts.   But any opinions expressed are the opinions      =
=  only of myself and may or may not reflect the opinions of anybody   =
=  else with whom I may or may not have discussed the issues at hand.  =
========================================================================  

• Follow-Ups:
  • RE: When you create a markup language, what do your parent elements mean? What do your children elements mean?
    • From: "Len Bullard" <cbullard@hiwaay.net>

• References:
  • When you create a markup language, what do your parent elementsmean? What do your children elements mean?
    • From: "Costello, Roger L." <costello@mitre.org>
  • Re: When you create a markup language, what do yourparent elements mean? What do your children elements mean?
    • From: Liam R E Quin <liam@w3.org>