Re: Random UUID in pure XSLT?

> This all leads me to think that a non-deterministic fn:refresh-document()
function might be useful in certain circumstances,
> but that we would be well advised to leave the plain-vanilla document()
function (and its ilk such as doc() and unparsed-text()) deterministic.
> They are already a way of sneaking external state into the
transformation. (As such, very useful.
> Does my Schematron find my listing in the bibliography feed *today*?) I'd
like to keep it easy to observe those boundaries

I thought just adding another overload for these functions:

*functionName($uri as xs:string, $isDeterministic as xs:boolean)*

Dimitre

On Thu, Nov 12, 2020 at 12:33 PM Wendell Piez wapiez@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx <
xsl-list-service@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

> Hi,
>
> Norm has it right (I think) that following this rule and being able to
> trust that a processor should follow this rule (even when it does not), is
> an important stabilizing factor in XSLT development, enabling a very useful
> separation of concerns whose boundaries run close to the governance
> boundaries (who is actually in control of which data set).
>
> And like David I worry what about when the scoping of variables and
> parameters becomes an issue in determining what should be at the end of a
> URI, whether it is the same, and whether I should care how many times a
> processor makes an attempt on it.
>
> As far as the theory goes, I think Dimitre put his finger on it when he
> pointed out the distinction between a closed system and an open one. To
> what Norm and Dave have said, I think XSLT has been very well served by
> maintaining this "closed universe" fiction. Indeed as Dave P has also
> hinted, such a regimen of
> data control (in which data that is not controlled, is at least well
> understood) is more or less essential to a scalable publishing operation.
>
> This all leads me to think that a non-deterministic fn:refresh-document()
> function might be useful in certain circumstances, but that we would be
> well advised to leave the plain-vanilla document() function (and its ilk
> such as doc() and unparsed-text()) deterministic. They are already a way of
> sneaking external state into the transformation. (As such, very useful.
> Does my Schematron find my listing in the bibliography feed *today*?) I'd
> like to keep it easy to observe those boundaries.
>
> Cheers, Wendell
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On Thu, Nov 12, 2020 at 11:39 AM Norm Tovey-Walsh ndw@xxxxxxxxxx <
> xsl-list-service@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>
>> > I don't expect that anyone wrote XSLT code that relies on these
>> functions
>> > being deterministic.
>>
>> I would be very reluctant to endorse that claim. I have relied on this
>> *all the time* in as much as Ibve never given a moment of thought to
>> whether or not fn:doc() could possibly return a different answer because
>> I know I donbt have to.
>>
>>                                         Be seeing you,
>>                                           norm
>>
>> --
>> Norman Tovey-Walsh <ndw@xxxxxxxxxx>
>> https://nwalsh.com/
>>
>> > Mistakes are a part of being human. Appreciate your mistakes for what
>> > they are: precious life lessons that can only be learned the hard way.
>> > Unless it's a fatal mistake, which, at least, others can learn
>> > from.--Al Franken
>>
>
>
> --
> ...Wendell Piez... ...wendell -at- nist -dot- gov...
> ...wendellpiez.com... ...pellucidliterature.org... ...pausepress.org...
> ...github.com/wendellpiez... ...gitlab.coko.foundation/wendell...
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>


--
Cheers,
Dimitre Novatchev
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Truly great madness cannot be achieved without significant intelligence.
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To invent, you need a good imagination and a pile of junk
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Never fight an inanimate object
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To avoid situations in which you might make mistakes may be the
biggest mistake of all
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Quality means doing it right when no one is looking.
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You've achieved success in your field when you don't know whether what
you're doing is work or play
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To achieve the impossible dream, try going to sleep.
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Facts do not cease to exist because they are ignored.
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Typing monkeys will write all Shakespeare's works in 200yrs.Will they write
all patents, too? :)
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Sanity is madness put to good use.
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I finally figured out the only reason to be alive is to enjoy it.