RE: [SUMMARY #1] Why is there little usage of XML on the'visib

Todd said:

1.      If browsers supported XML + CSS well, consistently, robustly, then you might see more XML on the web (but see #2).  Browers support (x)HTML, so the web gets XML + XSLT = (x)HTML.  This is less about XML and more about what browsers support.

Didier replies:

The problem with XML + CSS is that you very basic “data model” to rendition. I guess in, that “lack of support” statement I guess you refer to XSLT 2.0 since XSLT 1.0 is supported by more than 94% of the browsers on the market. I sincerely doubt very much that the lack of XML on the visible web is caused by a lack of capabilities in browsers. It’s more a question of copyright, business model, etc.. not really technical issues.

Todd said:

2.      The distinction made between "visible web" and "hidden web" seems to be made based on "human" versus "machine" consumption.  This distinction may be misplaed when one considers that XML over HTTP (without "web services") and web services (i.e., SOAP XML + XML over HTTP) can be delivered to a desktop application for human consumption.  Yes, the XML goes through an application/machine, but what is a browswer -- it is an application/machine as well.  XML over HTTP allows a developer to break away from the web browser, which provides consistency, speed, and control that a browser does not provide.  XML over HTTP allows one to avoid the browser and communicate with a desktop application that, in my view, makes human consumption much better/easier.

Didier replies:

What Roger meant by “machine” can also be translated by any other agent other than the browser.  It could eventually be translated into an interactive view presented to users but the source code of that application is probably not encoded into an explicit model to model transformation as we would do with data encode into xml and a rendering language based on XML. For instance, the transformation process into something the users can manipulate can be encoded into a Java application. When the latter is compiled, try to find the linkage or transformation between the data model and the final rendering. With an XSLT transformation you have a white box able to show you the relationship between the data model and the result of the transformation. Most of the other XML based apps are mostly based on a black box model where the transformation is convoluted into procedural languages and made opaque after a compilation. It is also the case that most of these apps are more of a  transactional nature than for user manipulation.

Cheers

Didier PH Martin