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RE: Web Services and Quality

• To: "Chiusano Joseph" <chiusano_joseph@b...>, "Nicolas Toper" <ntoper@j...>
• Subject: RE: Web Services and Quality
• From: "Cox, Bruce" <Bruce.Cox@U...>
• Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2003 16:00:42 -0400
• Cc: "Simon St.Laurent" <simonstl@s...>, <xml-dev@l...>
• Thread-index: AcN9VmwKjpyEj7ZtQ7KD8xN0zjcLqA==
• Thread-topic: Web Services and Quality

What about the Better Business Bureau?  Don't they record consumer
complaints and expose frauds?  (W3B3?) :-)

Seems to me that someone who wants to be in the rating service business
would prefer to establish their own metrics so that they have a unique
product to sell to consumers of web services.  WS consumers will buy the
service on the basis of proven reliability of the ratings.  Web-service
providers will cooperate to the extent that they value the impartial
endorsement.  In this case, I think the market dynamic will produce
better results than a standards organization.  Yes, there might be some
value to standardizing how the information is exchanged, but I'd leave
that to those with the money and burning desire to get into the
business; otherwise, they're likely to ignore your proposed standard.

Bruce B. Cox
SA4XMLT
USPTO/OCIO/AETS
703-306-2606


-----Original Message-----
From: Chiusano Joseph [mailto:chiusano_joseph@b...] 
Sent: Wednesday, September 17, 2003 12:54 PM
To: Nicolas Toper
Cc: Simon St.Laurent; xml-dev@l...
Subject: Re:  Web Services and Quality

Regarding metrics and measurement: I'm going through the W3C Web
Services Architecture (W3C Working Draft 8 August 2003[1]) which
presents 5 "architectural models" - one of these models is the
"Management Model". This model includes the concept of "management
metrics". It states:

"The value of the metric captures the information at a point in time.
Generally these values are numeric, but may be strings as well. This can
be contrasted with Measurements that are calculated with a formula based
on metrics, e.g. Average response time during the last hour of
execution. The metrics requirements do not enforce any implementation
pattern. A managed element should allow any available metrics and
measurements to be reported according to configurable time intervals,
such as cumulative, sliding window, and interval. A managed element must
declare which interval types are supported."

So one potential criteria for rating a Web service could be (as the
example above suggests) average response time. This could be computed
dynamically and updated at regular intervals, according to an advertised
method (e.g. cumulative, sliding window, and interval - as in the
example above).

Kind Regards,
Joe Chiusano
Booz | Allen | Hamilton

[1] http://www.w3.org/TR/ws-arch/


Nicolas Toper wrote:
> 
> the web have the same problem :=) if you find an answer you'll do 
> better than google (which might be a part of the solutions)
> 
> -----Message d'origine-----
> De : Chiusano Joseph [mailto:chiusano_joseph@b...] Envoye : 
> mercredi 17 septembre 2003 17:51 A : Simon St.Laurent Cc : 
> xml-dev@l... Objet : Re:  Web Services and Quality
> 
> <Quote>
> Determining whose feedback to listen to, while still keeping consumers

> free of legal or other retailiation from vendors seems like a bigger 
> problem than the technical issues.
> </Quote>
> 
> Yes - it seems like there would need to be some sort of established 
> and respected ratings service (much like Arbitron rates TV stations 
> here in the US(?)). Another possibility is for an open standards 
> consortium (such as OASIS) to, through a TC, establish a framework for

> Web Services rating with wide vendor participation. A large vendor 
> backing would add further legitimacy to such a framework. Then, the 
> framework could be adopted by a Web service and the various values 
> provided by that Web service.
> 
> Of course, that leads to the question of how to get Web service 
> providers to honestly provide values for their services...
> 
> Kind Regards,
> Joe Chiusano
> Booz | Allen | Hamilton
> 
> "Simon St.Laurent" wrote:
> >
> > chiusano_joseph@b... (Chiusano Joseph) writes:
> > >Lately I've been thinking about what's around the corner for Web 
> > >services (whether we're close to that corner yet or not is a 
> > >separate issue). The notion of dynamic discovery and collaboration 
> > >of Web services comes to mind (choreography, business processes, 
> > >etc.) - but I'm also thinking in terms of how a Web service can
judge the "quality"
> > >of another Web service. My question is: is anyone aware of any 
> > >current efforts on rating Web services?
> >
> > I don't have a good answer for this, but have heard several 
> > suggestions for providing EBay-like feedback on services using
UDDI-like approaches.
> >
> > Determining whose feedback to listen to, while still keeping 
> > consumers free of legal or other retailiation from vendors seems 
> > like a bigger problem than the technical issues.
> >
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