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Re: Sun and independent developers

• From: Dave Winer <dave@u...>
• To: Leigh Dodds <ldodds@i...>, xml-dev@l...
• Date: Thu, 06 Sep 2001 09:20:07 -0700

That's certainly one of the objections, the other is that the name of the
document is unecessarily confusing. When there's confusion about what a term
means it tends to halt progress, which in this case would be unfair, and
imho not even in Sun's interest. Having made a big investment here, I don't
want to see the value of XML-RPC diluted or its meaning confused. Dave


----- Original Message -----
From: "Leigh Dodds" <ldodds@i...>
To: "Dave Winer" <dave@u...>; <xml-dev@l...>
Sent: Thursday, September 06, 2001 8:06 AM
Subject: RE: Sun and independent developers


> Is the issue to do with the fact that the work on XML-RPC isn't
> being recognised (e.g. as a possible source of implementation
> experience), or that this JCR may sideline that work by putting
> a rubber stamp on SOAP/XP?
>
> As the JCR notes that, it "will not attempt to develop,
> define, or constrain network protocols or network data formats
> or network interface definition languages.", its seems like XML-RPC
> could be supported as a "pluggable" (to quote the JCR again) protocol
> just like any other. So there doesn't seem much scope for sidelining.
>
> It's certainly surprising that XML-RPC isn't noted as a reference
> though.
>
> Cheers,
>
> L.
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Dave Winer [mailto:dave@u...]
> > Sent: 06 September 2001 15:48
> > To: xml-rpc@y...; soapbuilders@y...;
> > decentralization@y...; xml-dev@l...;
> > xml-dist-app@w...
> > Cc: Tim O'Reilly
> > Subject: Sun and independent developers
> >
> >
> > To whom it may concern..
> >
> > A few months ago a document [1] appeared entitled "Java APIs for
> > XML RPC." I
> > sent an email to Anne Thomas-Manes, strenuously objecting. The document
> > didn't point to XML-RPC [2], although it attempts to survey the
> > landscape in
> > XML-over-HTTP protocols. XML-RPC was the first such protocol, and
arguably
> > is the most used, with 45 implementations [3] (including Java), a frozen
> > spec, and a very active developer community.
> >
> > Their lawyers got in the loop and claimed that they had the right
> > to confuse
> > developers and users, however, as a "courtesy to Dave Winer," they
changed
> > the document and the crisis was over. Yesterday Paul Nakada [4]
discovered
> > that the document is back in its original form, with support from lots
of
> > well-known companies. This is disturbing. It isn't about me, forget the
> > courtesy, try self-respect, and support for independent developers.
> >
> > There are so many reasons for the XML-RPC community to work with Sun. We
> > could help them stay in the market if they just worked with us --
instead
> > they pick on us. Unbelievable. They just must not be thinking
> > strategically
> > at Sun. Maybe this could get the conversation going about how to
> > strengthen
> > Java to preserve developer choice. It's really quite simple. Just ask
and
> > we'll help you.
> >
> > BTW, I got an email from Anne saying she had left Sun to work at Idoox.
> > Perhaps that has something to do with this reversal.
> >
> > Bottom-line, if you work at Sun, or work at one of their partner
> > companies,
> > especially if your company is listed as a supporter on that page
> > [1], get in
> > touch with the people responsible for this work and ask them to
> > get in touch
> > with the XML-RPC community. Instead of trying to roll us over
> > (why?) -- work
> > with us. We want a multi-party system. We don't want to get in the trunk
> > with Microsoft. We want our independence, and for that, we want
> > to see Java
> > stay strong. The term XML-RPC means something. Respect that, and
> > enhance it.
> > Thanks for listening.
> >
> > Dave Winer
> > UserLand Software
> >
> > [1] http://jcp.org/jsr/detail/101.jsp
> > [2] http://www.xmlrpc.com/
> > [3] http://www.xmlrpc.com/directory/1568/implementations
> > [4] http://mynakada.weblogs.com/2001/09/05
> >
> >
> >
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  • RE: Sun and independent developers
    • From: Leigh Dodds <ldodds@i...>

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