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The XML-DEV Blog

The XML-DEV email discussion forum was started nearly 10 years ago by Dr. Peter Murray-Rust and Dr. Henry Rzepa of Imperial College (UK), covering XML development topics including XML standards, XML specifications, and technical questions related to the eXtensible Markup Language. The XML-DEV Blog brings the XML-DEV community into the blogging era, enabling XML developers to easily follow the hottest threads in the blogosphere.


reflecting on XML's 20th anniversary

Posted 2/14/2018 12:46:09 PM

for the attention of readers,The following posts reflect about XML's 20th anniversary.https://www.xml.com/articles/2018/02/10/xml-20/   (Tim Bray's post)http://blog.arcanedomain.com/2018/02/tim-bray-posts-on-the-20th-anniversary-of-xml/ (Noah Mendelsohn citing Tim Bray's post)-- Regards . . . Read full entry »


Re: Re: Is XML only half finished? The X Refactor

Posted 2/13/2018 1:06:49 AM

I collected it, added an example, and put it up at Schematron.com.   I would be interested in any comments, on XML-DEV.RegardsRickOn Mon, Feb 12, 2018 at 11:02 PM, Cecil New <cecil.new@gmail.com> wrote:Should make this a Google doc so everyone can view . . . Read full entry »


Re: Is XML only half finished? The X Refactor

Posted 2/12/2018 2:35:16 PM

Ooops, format got lost. Try again. Where is XML thriving? Industrial document production using semantic markup: the traditional SGML market of high complexity, multi-publishing, and long life span.Desktop office formats using XML-in-ZIP: ODF and OOXMLData that has mixed content Data that absolutel . . . Read full entry »


Is XML only half finished? The X Refactor

Posted 2/12/2018 2:32:00 PM

Where is XML thriving? * Industrial document production using semantic markup: the traditional SGML market of high complexity, multi-publishing, and long life span.* Desktop office formats using XML-in-ZIP: ODF and OOXML* Data that has mixed content * Data that absolutely needs schema validation as . . . Read full entry »


Re: Re: Is XML only half finished? The X Refactor

Posted 2/12/2018 12:02:44 PM

Should make this a Google doc so everyone can view and comment on it!On Sun, Feb 11, 2018, 10:35 PM Rick Jelliffe <rjelliffe@allette.com.au> wrote:Ooops, format got lost. Try again. Where is XML thriving? Industrial doc . . . Read full entry »


Re: The DTD summary: the road not taken

Posted 2/12/2018 2:50:57 AM

On Mon, 2018-02-12 at 01:03 -0500, John Cowan wrote: > > [...] The most interesting lost feature was the DTD summary, Yes - we lost a lot with moving away from architectural forms. It's possible xlink would have been different, too, as teh architectural forms counter-proposal might've car . . . Read full entry »


The DTD summary: the road not taken

Posted 2/12/2018 1:03:30 AM

I decided to look past the 1998 1st Edition of XML back to the first draft, internally version 0.01, in 1996 to see what was in that draft that was later removed.  The most interesting lost feature was the DTD summary, a set of processing instructions with a target of "XML" that provided . . . Read full entry »


Re: Happy Birthday, XML!

Posted 2/11/2018 4:05:50 PM

On Sun, 2018-02-11 at 07:54 +0800, Henry Luo wrote: > So it might be time to look into alternatives, like Mark > (https://mark.js.org). :-) One of the strengths of XML is social: it enables people who don't think of themselves as programmers to do significant text processing. Another stre . . . Read full entry »


Re: Happy Birthday, XML!

Posted 2/11/2018 3:28:14 PM

On 11 Feb 2018, at 14:25, Patrick Durusau <patrick@durusau.net> wrote: Michael,If not an alternative syntax, what about a more dynamic reading of XML syntax? Yes, XML lacks complex objects (https://mark.js.org/) as attribute . . . Read full entry »


Re: Happy Birthday, XML!

Posted 2/11/2018 3:18:12 PM

FtanML for the winOn Sun, 11 Feb 2018 at 3:25 pm, Patrick Durusau <patrick@durusau.net> wrote: Michael, If not an alternative syntax, what about a more dynamic reading of XML syntax? Yes, XML lacks complex o . . . Read full entry »


Re: Happy Birthday, XML!

Posted 2/11/2018 2:31:19 PM

The wheel turns.  So we have had 10 years each with SGML winning at the top with long-term industrial and legal documentation from the late 1980s, XML expanding from the middle out from the late 1990s, and JSON winning from the low-end up from the late 2000s.  Is it time for the next thing?   What . . . Read full entry »


Re: Happy Birthday, XML!

Posted 2/11/2018 10:30:59 AM

On Sun, Feb 11, 2018 at 4:41 AM, Michael Kay <mike@saxonica.com> wrote:We had Yet Another Alternative Syntax for XML presented at XML Prague, under the name SML. I fear that all such efforts are doomed to failure. The benefits of the alternativ . . . Read full entry »


Re: Happy Birthday, XML!

Posted 2/11/2018 9:41:21 AM

We had Yet Another Alternative Syntax for XML presented at XML Prague, under the name SML. I fear that all such efforts are doomed to failure. The benefits of the alternative syntax over XML, however much better it is, aren't great enough to justify the cost of being different. It's like improving . . . Read full entry »


Re: Happy Birthday, XML!

Posted 2/11/2018 9:25:16 AM

Michael, If not an alternative syntax, what about a more dynamic reading of XML syntax? Yes, XML lacks complex objects (https://mark.js.org/) as attribute values but nothing prevents us from inserting such objects into an XML event stream. The nex . . . Read full entry »


Re: Happy Birthday, XML!

Posted 2/11/2018 7:54:47 AM

As said: It seems obvious that the most important thing about XML is that it was the first. People did a lot of that with XML just because there was no other alternative. So it might be time to look into alternatives, . . . Read full entry »


Re: Happy Birthday, XML!

Posted 2/10/2018 7:15:29 PM

And of course we celebrated the birthday today at XML Prague. Michael Kay > On 10 Feb 2018, at 17:48, Lauren Wood <lauren@textuality.com> wrote: > > There's a shorter piece on XML.com, written by Tim Bray. > > https://www . . . Read full entry »


Happy Birthday, XML!

Posted 2/10/2018 5:34:36 PM

Since nobody else seems to bother, I've written a blog post on the occasion of the 20th anniversary of the publication of the XML 1.0 recommendation at http://sgmljs.net/blog/blog1802.html , focussing on XML in the larger markup context. Right now there's also a discussion going on at https://www. . . . Read full entry »


Re: Happy Birthday, XML!

Posted 2/10/2018 9:48:42 AM

There's a shorter piece on XML.com, written by Tim Bray. https://www.xml.com/articles/2018/02/10/xml-20/ cheers, Lauren On Sat, Feb 10, 2018 at 8:34 AM, u123724 <u123724@gmail.com> wrote: > Since nobody else seems to bother, I've written a blog p . . . Read full entry »


[ANN] Call for Participation: Balisage 2018

Posted 2/5/2018 3:45:57 PM

Balisage: The Markup Conference 2018 July 31 — 3, 2018, Rockville, MD (a suburb of Washington, DC) July 30, 2018 — Pre-conference Symposium - Topic to be announced https://www.balisage.net/ Are you interested in open information, reusable documents, and vendor and application independence? Then y . . . Read full entry »


Graphical mapping tools

Posted 1/29/2018 8:17:29 AM

Dear colleagues,what is the state of the art concerning graphical mapping tools? (I mean tools which are based on graphical representations of source and target tree and let the user draw connections.) Have you positive or negative experience? Are there products which enable non-trivial mappings wi . . . Read full entry »


Re: {mark} - a new simple notation that unifies JSON andXML

Posted 1/26/2018 5:16:27 PM

I am afraid that just big companies can specify notations which will become successful because they will also provide engines to process them and because, then, people will be eager to announce that they are experts for them... Anyway, I consider that the a . . . Read full entry »


Re: {mark} - a new simple notation that unifies JSON andXML

Posted 1/26/2018 2:37:21 PM

Just to elaborate a bit more on the issue: Imagine element <price currency="USD">5.00</price> goes through a transformation process to give some output: should it be {span 'Price' ':' ' ' 'USD' '$' 5.00 null ''}, i.e. keep the items as they . . . Read full entry »


Re: {mark} - a new simple notation that unifies JSON and XML

Posted 1/26/2018 2:34:43 PM

I think this new notation will further complicate the world of data formats. The current technology landscape involving XML, JSON and HTML & associated integration technologies seems sufficient to me to provide solutions to existing use cases in this field.Sent from an Android deviceOn Jan 25, . . . Read full entry »


Re: {mark} - a new simple notation that unifies JSON andXML

Posted 1/26/2018 1:37:34 PM

Hi Michael, Thanks for sharing your thoughts on the specific issue of content model for element/object. Here are my thoughts on this specific issue. There are two options here, each with its pros and cons. Option 1: Orthogonal approach, allows any value in ele . . . Read full entry »


Six Things You Need (was) {mark} - a new simple notation that unifiesJSO

Posted 1/26/2018 9:22:34 AM

Michael Kay <mike@saxonica.com>:Getting critical mass in terms of take-up of an idea like this is not easy. Preconditions include:* a clean design* open source implementations for a sufficient number of important platforms* a strong recognition i . . . Read full entry »


Re: {mark} - a new simple notation that unifies JSON andXML

Posted 1/26/2018 1:41:42 AM

Thanks for being precise to add back the whitespaces. On Fri 26/1/18 1:32 AM, Eliot Kimber wrote: I think you meant   {root 'text1 ' {foo} ' text2'} The white space is always significant in . . . Read full entry »


Re: {mark} - a new simple notation that unifies JSON andXML

Posted 1/26/2018 1:20:12 AM

Thanks, Eliot for your fast response. <root>text1 <foo/> text2</root> in Mark would be: {root 'text1' {foo} 'text2'} Regards Henry On Fri 26/1/18 1:04 AM, Eliot Kimber wrote: Ho . . . Read full entry »


{mark} - a new simple notation that unifies JSON and XML

Posted 1/26/2018 12:43:14 AM

Dear all, I am happy to announce the first public beta release of Mark - a simple notation that unifies JSON and XML. You can find out more about it at https://mark.js.org/ Objective Markup Notation, abbreviated as Mark or {mark}, is a new unified notation for . . . Read full entry »


Re: {mark} - a new simple notation that unifies JSON and XML

Posted 1/25/2018 6:39:16 PM

That is also a concern that I have when designing Mark. Should it be generalized to allow any value in content? Do we have any solid usecase for storing number and boolean in content? They are probably not needed for normal mixed content usage.I don't think the absence of a use ca . . . Read full entry »


Re: {mark} - a new simple notation that unifies JSON and XML

Posted 1/25/2018 5:24:36 PM

There are many similarlities with FtanML: https://www.balisage.net/Proceedings/vol10/html/Kay01/BalisageVol10-Kay01.htmlIt's not clear what mixed content ends up looking like: getting that right is one of the key design challenges.Getting critical mass in terms of take-up of an idea like this . . . Read full entry »


Re: {mark} - a new simple notation that unifies JSON and XML

Posted 1/25/2018 12:18:52 PM

I agree with Eliot that without a proper representation of mixed content no new format can  subsume XML.  I would urge you to look at FtanML by Michael Kay and friends at <https://www.balisage.net/Proceedings/vol10/html/Kay01/BalisageVol10-Kay01.html> for something that truly does subsume bot . . . Read full entry »


Re: {mark} - a new simple notation that unifies JSON andXML

Posted 1/25/2018 11:32:35 AM

I think you meant {root 'text1 ' {foo} ' text2'}The white space is always significant in mixed content. But if this is allowed then I think the mixed content requirement is satisfied and in a natural and XML-similar way. Cheers, E.--Eliot Kimberhttp://contrext.com  Fro . . . Read full entry »


Re: {mark} - a new simple notation that unifies JSON andXML

Posted 1/25/2018 11:04:57 AM

How would XML mixed content be encoded  in mark? That is, if I have <root>text1 <foo/> text2</root> What does that look like in mark? Otherwise, based on a first reading, it looks, syntactically, like it is structurally equivalent to XML except as regards attri . . . Read full entry »


Re: Was OOXML's problem that it should have used JSON not XML?

Posted 1/24/2018 3:23:07 PM

I had a project where we first resolved version variants (using a commercial library), then converted to rich XHTML (using a comnercial library), then transformed thst to the target (using xslt2).But one or more simplifying/resolving steps seems the only way to get the information to where it is sw . . . Read full entry »


Re: Was OOXML's problem that it should have used JSON not XML?

Posted 1/24/2018 3:02:11 PM

Sounds good. Sorting out what a character is --when using old pre-unicode non-ascii fonts-- must be tricky.I understand that, in the case of standards documenting pre-existing technologies like ISO/IEC 29500-1, the technology leads and the standard follows.  But now, after 10 years, have there been . . . Read full entry »


Sparksoniq 0.9.1 Spruce: first alpha release

Posted 1/24/2018 1:51:56 PM

Dear all, I am happy to announce the first alpha release of Sparksoniq: 0.9.1 Spruce, under an Apache 2.0 license. You can try it out with its shell and its documentation on http://sparksoniq.org In a nutshell, this is a JSONiq engine [see below what it has to do with XQuery and XML . . . Read full entry »


Re: Was OOXML's problem that it should have used JSON not XML?

Posted 1/24/2018 1:15:04 PM

Hans-Juergen: Yes, the difference is perhaps more in people's expectation of what the information language promises.Michael Kay:  But who would process OOXML using XSLT in that way? I have built several systems that generate OOXML, and one that reads it and substitutes some values, but I think . . . Read full entry »


Re: Was OOXML's problem that it should have used JSON not XML?

Posted 1/24/2018 12:22:06 PM

>(XML-DEVers may not be aware, but one of Murata-san's jobs for the last 10 years has been diligently working through the QA on ISO OOXML, trying to keep up with a moving target, correct where the initial documentation was wrong or speculative or incomplete, and making sure it has the inform . . . Read full entry »


Re: Was OOXML's problem that it should have used JSON notXML?

Posted 1/24/2018 8:22:34 AM

Gareth—generating HTML from the simplified XML is an interesting idea that I had not considered. The approach I took for debugging was to capture the XPath in the OOXML source of the paragraph that ultimately resulted in some DITA element in the final output. From that I could then go bac . . . Read full entry »


Re: Was OOXML's problem that it should have used JSON notXML?

Posted 1/24/2018 4:09:47 AM

Oh that’s interesting to note. We took a very similar approach with a Word-to-S1000D conversion tool that we wrote. We invented some intermediate “FlatXML” schema that resolved all the cruft from the Word XML and provided a springboard for the S1000D data module outputs. The final process . . . Read full entry »


Re: Constraints on the elements in a nested XML tree?

Posted 1/23/2018 11:10:00 PM

On 23 January 2018 at 22:54, Costello, Roger L. <costello@mitre.org> wrote:Hi Folks, I am dealing with XML trees. No id/idrefs. No mixed content. Just plain old properly nested elements. Suppose I have a pile of elements and I want a m . . . Read full entry »


Constraints on the elements in a nested XML tree?

Posted 1/23/2018 10:54:48 PM

Hi Folks, I am dealing with XML trees. No id/idrefs. No mixed content. Just plain old properly nested elements. Suppose I have a pile of elements and I want a machine to assemble them into a tree of properly nested elements. The machine doesn't know the rules for assembly so I must tell it the . . . Read full entry »


Re: Was OOXML's problem that it should have used JSON notXML?

Posted 1/23/2018 9:46:19 PM

See https://github.com/dita4publishers/org.dita4publishers.word2dita This is an XSLT2 framework for producing sophisticated DITA document sets from styled Word documents. The input is Word OOXML.  It makes heavy use of for-each-group to deal with the flat nature of OOXML. Basically the fi . . . Read full entry »


Re: The Einstein Puzzle

Posted 1/23/2018 7:23:33 PM

On Mon, 15 Jan 2018 13:59:59 +0000, "Costello, Roger L." <costello@mitre.org> wrote: | The Einstein Puzzle Gosh, this brought back memories! I saw this in the Reader's Digest a _very_ long time ago, but some details were di . . . Read full entry »


Re: Was OOXML's problem that it should have used JSON not XML?

Posted 1/23/2018 7:11:19 PM

I do not know schema technologies for JSON well.  Unless it can mmic at least XSD schemas for OOXML, JSON-based rewrite of OOXML will simply make things worse.Regards,Makoto2018-01-23 18:39 GMT+09:00 Michael Kay <mike@saxonica.com>:No, I don't . . . Read full entry »


Was OOXML's problem that it should have used JSON not XML?

Posted 1/23/2018 2:58:56 PM

Here's a thought.  OOXML (Office Open XML) is criticized for being like a dump of MS Office's binary format: it is not altogether unfair because the aim was to completely represent the native format and much of that was simply not "semantic" let alone elegant.  But it meant that s . . . Read full entry »


Re: Was OOXML's problem that it should have used JSON not XML?

Posted 1/23/2018 10:21:55 AM

There's another challenge with converting this kind of material to JSON <w:p> <w:pPr> <w:pStyle w:val="Heading1"/> </w:pPr> <w:r><w:t>Favorites</w:t></w:r> </w:p> There's a heavy dependence on sibling relationships here: the st . . . Read full entry »


Re: Was OOXML's problem that it should have used JSON not XML?

Posted 1/23/2018 9:39:48 AM

No, I don't think encoding this stuff in JSON rather than XML would have made it one iota more accessible. The problem is that it was designed bottom-up rather than top-down: it offers what's easiest for the implementation to deliver, not what is most convenient for the users to digest. We've done . . . Read full entry »


Re: Was OOXML's problem that it should have used JSON notXML?

Posted 1/23/2018 8:10:43 AM

Very interesting thought. At first, I was at a loss what you meant - in my opinion, XML technology is without serious competitor concerning the art of addressing information, and, by implication, the disciplines of navigation, extraction, aggregation, transformation. So why should something be "rea . . . Read full entry »


JAXB using XSD 1.1

Posted 1/20/2018 11:59:14 AM

Hello,    Is anyone aware, that is there any movement within the JAXB community to release a version that supports XSD 1.1?-- Regards,Mukul Gandhi . . . Read full entry »


AW: Schema aware XSLT runtime error - is it a bug?

Posted 1/17/2018 5:42:13 AM

Thank you Mike. I can see that this bug is already solved in the Saxon 9.8 trunk. I will update the Oxygen Forum Entry. Frank Steimke Von: mike@saxonica.com [mailto:mike@saxonica.com] Ge . . . Read full entry »


RE: Schema aware XSLT runtime error - is it a bug?

Posted 1/16/2018 10:35:48 PM

This is followed up as a Saxon bug here:https://saxonica.plan.io/issues/3628Michael KaySaxonica----- Original Message ----- From: mike@saxonica.com [mailto:mike@saxonica.com] To: f-steimke@b..., xml-dev@l... Cc: support@o... Sent: Tue, 16 . . . Read full entry »


RE: Schema aware XSLT runtime error - is it a bug?

Posted 1/16/2018 6:54:26 PM

Interesting.Saxon is creating the <tns:t> element with a type annotation of xs:string (rather than tns:T). The code does this quite deliberately, but I cannot find anything in the specs to justify it. The spec that defines how type annotations are established is the XDM data model, §3.3.1.1, . . . Read full entry »


Schema aware XSLT runtime error - is it a bug?

Posted 1/16/2018 6:41:19 PM

Dear list, i have an schema aware XSLT script which leads to a runtime error: type mismatch. I don't understand that error, and think it may be a bug, so I wrote an entry in the Oxygen Forum (see https://www.oxygenxml.com/forum/topic15402.html). The Oxygen staff has tested with different versions o . . . Read full entry »


Re: The Einstein Puzzle

Posted 1/16/2018 10:58:57 AM

Nice to see this!One angle I would say is that the SAT terminology "constraint" is somewhat different from the schema terminology of "constraint".  Schemas don't say that the Englishman lives in the red house, they say that all Englishmen we are interested in live in red hou . . . Read full entry »


The Einstein Puzzle

Posted 1/15/2018 1:59:59 PM

Hi Folks,   Scenario: You create an XML Schema that specifies the structure of XML instances. You create a Schematron schema that specifies constraints.   Sometimes constraints are complex. In such cases it may not be immediately obvious what instances satisfy the constraints. The Ei . . . Read full entry »


Re: MIME type versus stand-alone format?

Posted 1/12/2018 6:27:15 PM

                 vCard is now not only a MIME type                but a stand-alone format.  What does that mean?I suspect that they are us . . . Read full entry »


MIME type versus stand-alone format?

Posted 1/12/2018 5:59:59 PM

Hi Folks,   In Microsoft Outlook you can create "contacts." You can export a contact. The exported contact is formatted as a vCard (virtual card). It contains things like name, address, email, telephone, etc.   The vCard specification had its origins way back in 1996. Since . . . Read full entry »


Re: Schematron tip: Use only one pattern

Posted 1/12/2018 10:17:10 AM

Traditionally Saxon organizes patterns into groups based on the element name. If we can tell statically what element name the pattern matches, and if there are relatively few patterns for each element name, then you get very good matching performance. If there are many patterns for a given element . . . Read full entry »


Re: Schematron tip: Use only one pattern

Posted 1/12/2018 9:58:50 AM

On 22.12.2017 13:53, Costello, Roger L. wrote: > It's no wonder that validation was so slow. > > My fix was to get rid of 29 patterns and put all the rules into one pattern. After doing that validation ran much faster. Alternative solution is to rewrite way how Schematron gets compiled i . . . Read full entry »


A web of documents?

Posted 1/9/2018 7:02:13 AM

Seemingly forgotten? W3C redressing the balance https://www.w3.org/blog/2018/01/what-does-the-publishing-industry-bring-to-the-web/ regards -- Dave Pawson XSLT XSL-FO FAQ. Docbook FAQ. . . . Read full entry »


Re: Need a language whiz: An XML Schema "specifies" howdata is

Posted 1/8/2018 8:20:30 PM

I still don't see what the novelty of "epischemas" is supposed to be, apart from giving a name (which is welcome).   James Clark did this parallel grammar technique for HTML IIRC, as a way to reconstruct SGML's exclusion exceptions (i.e. that an <a> could not contain an < . . . Read full entry »


Re: Need a language whiz: An XML Schema "specifies" howdata is

Posted 1/8/2018 12:52:30 PM

On 08/01/2018 11:14, Tony Graham wrote: On 08/01/2018 09:20, Rick Jelliffe wrote: I still don't see what the novelty of "epischemas" is supposed to be,  apart from giving a name (which is welcome).   James Clark did this  parallel grammar technique for HTML IIRC, as a way to reconstru . . . Read full entry »


Re: Need a language whiz: An XML Schema "specifies" howdata is

Posted 1/8/2018 10:14:56 AM

On 08/01/2018 09:20, Rick Jelliffe wrote: I still don't see what the novelty of "epischemas" is supposed to be, apart from giving a name (which is welcome). James Clark did this parallel grammar technique for HTML IIRC, as a way to reconstruct SGML's IIRC, Gerrit did refer to James . . . Read full entry »


Re: Need a language whiz: An XML Schema "specifies" howdata is

Posted 1/8/2018 7:43:33 AM

On 07/01/2018 22:17, Andrew Sales wrote: It's a reality which (again) the publishing sector has been living with since ever publishers started using markup. They acknowledge or cope with it to a greater or lesser degree: the old-style trope was to have an "authoring DTD" and a "pu . . . Read full entry »


Re: Need a language whiz: An XML Schema "specifies" howdata is

Posted 1/7/2018 10:17:24 PM

It's a reality which (again) the publishing sector has been living with since ever publishers started using markup.They acknowledge or cope with it to a greater or lesser degree: the old-style trope was to have an "authoring DTD" and a "publishing DTD", the latter more finel . . . Read full entry »


Re: References to unparsed entities

Posted 1/6/2018 7:13:47 PM

On Sat, Jan 6, 2018 at 6:14 PM, Ronald Bourret <rpbourret@rpbourret.com> wrote:Section 4.4.9 states: "The following ... constitute fatal errors: the appearance of a reference to an unparsed entity, except in the EntityValue . . . Read full entry »


Re: References to unparsed entities

Posted 1/6/2018 4:41:59 PM

Thanks. I hadn't noticed the difference between error and fatal error. -- Ronb On 1/6/2018 4:13 PM, John Cowan wrote: On Sat, Jan 6, 2018 at 6:14 PM, Ronald Bourret <rpbourret@rpbourret.com <mailto:rpb . . . Read full entry »


References to unparsed entities

Posted 1/6/2018 3:14:34 PM

Section 4.4.9 states: "The following ... constitute fatal errors: the appearance of a reference to an unparsed entity, except in the EntityValue in an entity declaration." Section 4.4.9 states: "It is an error for a reference to an unparsed entity to appear in the EntityValue i . . . Read full entry »


Parameter entities in internal subset

Posted 1/6/2018 3:09:41 PM

I haven't been here for quite a while, so hello to everyone. As a way to learn git, I've been fixing some ancient bugs in my DTD Parser, and that has led me to the Joy of Entities. I understand the intent, but am missing a few details and the deeper I dig, the more my head spins. Section 2.8 ( . . . Read full entry »


Re: Need a language whiz: An XML Schema "specifies" how data i

Posted 1/6/2018 9:13:12 AM

> > Theoretically, although I have never seen it with XSD and would > probably think it was a weird use of the language, you could have > multiple schemas for validating documents in the same namespace. I have seen one client who was attempting to do this: essentially applying stricte . . . Read full entry »


Re: Need a language whiz: An XML Schema "specifies" howdata is

Posted 1/5/2018 3:01:21 PM

Theoretically, although I have never seen it with XSD and would probably think it was a weird use of the language, you could have multiple schemas for validating documents in the same namespace. This is implied by some of the other emails in this thread, where one has a chain of validations, and ea . . . Read full entry »


Re: Need a language whiz: An XML Schema "specifies" howdata is

Posted 1/5/2018 10:26:41 AM

This is not really an answer, but I wonder whether we are being hampered by a category error, that we should be seeing validators as kinds of expert systems, now that AI is regarded positively again?A schema is the ruleset for an expert system that uses XML documents as inputs.  The expert system m . . . Read full entry »


Re: Need a language whiz: An XML Schema "specifies" how data i

Posted 1/5/2018 7:28:27 AM

Greetings, and thank you all for your comments and hints. They are indeed very helpful. I totally agree that validation and assessment is only half the story. We can think of many reasons why we have to reject a document eventually, although it has passed the validation and assessment phases. Mayb . . . Read full entry »


Re: Need a language whiz: An XML Schema "specifies" howdata is

Posted 1/4/2018 4:06:58 PM

Greetings. On 4 Jan 2018, at 14:46, John Cowan wrote: But it seems to me that this is only half of assessment: if a document is valid, you may still decide to reject it for any of a variety of reasons: This, many times! I think people often become obsessed by XML validation, apparently forg . . . Read full entry »


Re: Need a language whiz: An XML Schema "specifies" howdata is

Posted 1/4/2018 1:46:51 PM

SGML has the idea of a "document type" which had a "definition", part of which was achieved by the "declarations" i.e. the DTD.  Due to the limitations of any schema language, the document type definition would never be entirely specified using the various declarations . . . Read full entry »


Re: AW: Need a language whiz: An XML Schema "specifies" howdat

Posted 1/4/2018 11:33:37 AM

FWIW, I draw the distinction conceptually but not verbally: I tend to think of the process of "validation" as not producing a binary, pass/fail result. It may do that, but in addition, there may be other advisory (warning/info etc) messages that require further judgement or intervention.  . . . Read full entry »


Re: AW: Need a language whiz: An XML Schema "specifies" howdat

Posted 1/4/2018 11:25:28 AM

We had exactly the same problems, with UBL-invoice also. We did a XSD validation, then a schematron validation to check the specific UBL-invoice uses of the context. The result of these two validations decided if a XML document was "conform", so acceptable or not. This was a technical . . . Read full entry »


Re: Need a language whiz: An XML Schema "specifies" howdata is

Posted 1/4/2018 9:46:23 AM

On Thu, Jan 4, 2018 at 1:59 AM, Frank Steimke <f-steimke@berger-und-steimke.de> wrote:  It means: decide whether you will accept or reject the message. This decision is of course based on the re . . . Read full entry »


Re: AW: Need a language whiz: An XML Schema "specifies"how dat

Posted 1/4/2018 3:11:31 AM

On Thu, 2018-01-04 at 07:59 +0100, Frank Steimke wrote: > [...] > We are pretty much interested about comments from the experts, > whether the distinction between these two phrases (and phases) makes > sense and seems to be useful. Since you've described it clearly it makes sense, at . . . Read full entry »


Re: Need a language whiz: An XML Schema "specifies" how data i

Posted 1/3/2018 4:24:55 PM

The essence of the semantics of XSD is that the specification defines a process, variously called "validation" or "assessment", that takes a schema and an instance document as input and produces an assessment outcome as its result. assess(schema, instance) => outcome (It's . . . Read full entry »


Re: Need a language whiz: An XML Schema "specifies" howdata is

Posted 1/3/2018 3:40:55 PM

The word choices betray viewpoints of reality - stating or specifying how data is to be structured assumes a blank canvas and the schema tells you how that canvas may be filled constrains assumes that data is a realm of many, perhaps infinite possibilities, XML Schema then constrains or limits the . . . Read full entry »


Re: Schematron tip: Use only one pattern

Posted 12/22/2017 6:10:10 PM

>Recall that a Schematron schema is converted to an XSLT program.Most users do use a/the XSLT implementation, but other, non-XSLT implementations are available. They may well handle patterns differently.On 22 December 2017 at 14:27, Imsieke, Gerrit, le-tex <gerrit.imsieke@le . . . Read full entry »


Re: Unexpected Ambiguous Model in XSD Schema

Posted 12/22/2017 5:18:53 PM

My guess it that given an instance like:<figure><img/></figure>the schema can figure out whether it is the type with maxOccurs="unbounded" or the type with minOccurs="1 maxOccurs="1"maybe minOccurs=2 maxOccurs="unbounded" would fix it.DanOn Fri, . . . Read full entry »


Re: Schematron tip: Use only one pattern

Posted 12/22/2017 3:27:09 PM

One reason for the acceleration could be that only the first matching rule within a pattern will be applied/evaluated. Roger, you might want to check whether the number of failed-asserts and successful-reports in the resulting SVRLs is the same for each scenario. It probably isn’t. So putting a . . . Read full entry »


Re: Schematron tip: Use only one pattern

Posted 12/22/2017 1:59:20 PM

“Why is validation so slow?” I wondered.I did some digging and discovered the reason for the slowness. Recall that a Schematron schema is converted to an XSLT program. I looked at the XSLT program that was generated for my Schematron schema. Here’s what I found:   <xsl:template match . . . Read full entry »


Schematron tip: Use only one pattern

Posted 12/22/2017 12:53:04 PM

Hi Folks, A Schematron schema contains patterns. Each pattern contains rules. Each rule contains asserts. I have large XML documents that I need to validate using Schematron. Each XML document is around 180 MB. My Schematron schema has many rules. So, I figured that I would categorize the set . . . Read full entry »


Re: Unexpected Ambiguous Model in XSD Schema

Posted 12/22/2017 12:18:54 PM

On 12/22/2017 12:12 PM, Eliot Kimber wrote: If I was coding this as a DTD it would be: <!ELEMENT figure ((figcaption, (img)+) | ((img)+, figcaption) | ((img)+)) Which is definitely not ambiguous. I disagree. An initial img can match either the second or third img token in . . . Read full entry »


Re: Unexpected Ambiguous Model in XSD Schema

Posted 12/22/2017 11:29:33 AM

Per Chris Maden, if I make the figcaption in the second sequence optional and remove the sequence with just img then everyone is happy. Cheers, E. --Eliot Kimberhttp://contrext.com  From: Dan Sullivan <dsullivan@danal.com& . . . Read full entry »


Re: Unexpected Ambiguous Model in XSD Schema

Posted 12/22/2017 11:25:48 AM

I think you're right (although Xerces didn't complain about my formulation). (img+, figcaption?) is the better way to express the intent. (Clearly it's been too long since I had to do serious DTD model development.) Cheers, E. -- Eliot Kimber http://contrext.com On 12/22/17, 11:18 AM, " . . . Read full entry »


Unexpected Ambiguous Model in XSD Schema

Posted 12/22/2017 11:12:47 AM

I'm working with a schema developed by others. Both Xerces and Saxon 9.7, run from within Oxygen, report ambiguity on this content model: <xs:element name="figure"> <xs:complexType> <xs:choice> <xs:sequence> <xs:element ref="figcaption&quo . . . Read full entry »


[ANN] Release of XMLmind Word To XML v1.4

Posted 12/18/2017 11:37:40 AM

Release of XMLmind Word To XML v1.4. Highlights: - Several enhancements related to the Web Help, EPUB and semantic XHTML formats. - Changed the technology used to implement the context-sensitive online help of w2x-app from obsolete JavaHelp to a dedicated, embedded Web browser displaying Web H . . . Read full entry »


[ANN] Release of XMLmind XML Editor v7.6

Posted 12/11/2017 11:59:53 AM

Release of XMLmind XML Editor v7.6. Highlights: - XMLmind XML Editor, which passed all non-regression tests, is now officially supported on Java[tm] 9 platforms. Getting XXE to compile cleanly and to run flawlessly using a Java 9 runtime required making a substantial number of minor changes . . . Read full entry »


Re: XML Parsing in Go

Posted 12/7/2017 8:28:13 PM

Should also add that I have only used the built-in parser once and it did a serviceable job. I used it to help a team understand the contents of some large XML files which had no DTD or XSD. Pretty printed they came to about 10K lines. I essentially computed counts of the elements, certain values o . . . Read full entry »


Re: XML Parsing in Go

Posted 12/7/2017 8:19:31 PM

The "tagged" structs in Go are more flexible than first appearances may show, but the built-in xml parser doesn't give a lot of options. Over at godocs.org a search on xml show some that may be of interest. But I can't vouch for any of them:- a pull parser https://godoc.org/github . . . Read full entry »


XML Parsing in Go

Posted 12/7/2017 1:59:50 PM

I'm looking into a project that will do some XML parsing and likely be implemented in Go. What do folks think of the available libraries? All I see so far seems to be based on the rather broken notion of data binding. (One more time: XML documents are not structs.) Is there any rough equivalent to . . . Read full entry »


Re: Which is more declarative? More XMLish?

Posted 12/4/2017 11:16:09 AM

I think you can validate a streaming document. Start with the proposition that a document is wellformed and valid until you find something that disproves it. That does not affect Dmitri's point about transactions, of course.Rick > Note: even XML well-formedness cannot be validated when strea . . . Read full entry »


Re: Which is more declarative? More XMLish?

Posted 12/3/2017 4:23:37 PM

>> Perhaps more interestingly, XPath 3.1 introduces maps, and there is no rule that says a map must be finite. It is possible to take a finite graph structure (such as schema component model) and represent each node in the graph as a map; the map will then be infinite (you can navigate around . . . Read full entry »


Re: Which is more declarative? More XMLish?

Posted 12/3/2017 2:57:27 AM

On Sat, 2017-12-02 at 09:04 -0800, Dimitre Novatchev wrote: > [...] > But an XML document cannot contain infinite number of > elements (unless W3C makes a new XML Spec allowing this -- and this > would be conveniently hand-in-hand with XSLT streaming). I several times wished we had mo . . . Read full entry »


Re: Which is more declarative? More XMLish?

Posted 12/2/2017 11:16:36 PM

The direction of thought I have in mind has nothing to do with "constrained vocabularies". It has to do with an extension of our thinking about XML: the introduction of "semantic identity", as opposed to node identity; or to put it simply: the view that complex XML elements describe a thing (its pr . . . Read full entry »


Re: Which is more declarative? More XMLish?

Posted 12/2/2017 10:53:28 PM

On 2 Dec 2017, at 22:18, Hans-Juergen Rennau <hrennau@yahoo.de> wrote:Michael Kay wrote: "the result of serializing the map as JSON and then converting the JSON to XML will be an infinite XML document"But this assumes a certain way of re . . . Read full entry »


Re: Which is more declarative? More XMLish?

Posted 12/2/2017 10:18:30 PM

Michael Kay wrote: "the result of serializing the map as JSON and then converting the JSON to XML will be an infinite XML document"But this assumes a certain way of representing JSON data in XML (or, more generally, "information objects" in XML), an assumption which is as habitual as it is complete . . . Read full entry »


Re: Which is more declarative? More XMLish?

Posted 12/2/2017 9:13:28 PM

> On 2 Dec 2017, at 18:15, Michael Kay <mike@saxonica.com> wrote: > > > I don't think there is any rule that says the number of elements in a document must be finite. > > ... > Perhaps more interestingly, XPat . . . Read full entry »


Re: Which is more declarative? More XMLish?

Posted 12/2/2017 6:15:53 PM

> On 2 Dec 2017, at 17:04, Dimitre Novatchev <dnovatchev@gmail.com> wrote: > > > This is not a set -- this is, strictly speaking, a sequence. > > More precisely, this is just one of the n! possible rep . . . Read full entry »


Re: Which is more declarative? More XMLish?

Posted 12/2/2017 3:28:56 PM

On 12/2/2017 9:26 AM, Costello, Roger L. wrote: Hi Folks, XML documents oftentimes contain a set of things – a set of books, a set of people, a set of transactions, etc. Typically, a set isn’t allowed to contain just anything, the set must satisfy some constraints. Constraints can be expressed . . . Read full entry »


Which is more declarative? More XMLish?

Posted 12/2/2017 2:26:36 PM

Hi Folks, XML documents oftentimes contain a set of things – a set of books, a set of people, a set of transactions, etc. Typically, a set isn’t allowed to contain just anything, the set must satisfy some constraints. Constraints can be expressed in different ways. Perhaps one way i . . . Read full entry »


Re: Which is more declarative? More XMLish?

Posted 12/2/2017 2:20:15 PM

On 12/2/2017 9:26 AM, Costello, Roger L. wrote: Hi Folks, XML documents oftentimes contain a set of things – a set of books, a set of people, a set of transactions, etc. The only XML documents I've seen contain elements, attributes, textual data, PIs, and DTDs. They never contain books . . . Read full entry »


Re: Which is more declarative? More XMLish?

Posted 12/2/2017 10:15:04 AM

Both rules would also allow: <numbers> <number>0</number> <number>2</number> <number>2</number> <number>4</number> <number>4</number> <number>4</number> <number>6</number> < . . . Read full entry »


Re: Which is more declarative? More XMLish?

Posted 12/2/2017 9:04:35 AM

Hi Roger, > Example: Here is an XML document containing a set (of positive even > numbers): > > <numbers> > <number>0</number> > <number>2</number> > <number>4</number> > <number>6</number> > > . . . Read full entry »


fragments and React

Posted 12/1/2017 2:26:08 PM

I keep finding that how different systems handle document fragments is a useful indicator of how they look at the world. React is a pretty popular framework from Facebook, one I mostly like except for odd things deriving from their particular mixture of markup and JavaScript. They recently adde . . . Read full entry »


Re: Embedding image files in XML using data URLs

Posted 11/29/2017 4:16:52 PM

> An xs:anyURI value can be a data URL.that's hardly surprising given that (in later interpretations of xsd) any string is valid xs:anyURI value.> An xs:anyURI value can either link to external data or it can inline the data using a data URL.or said differently   an xsl:anyURI value can r . . . Read full entry »


Embedding image files in XML using data URLs

Posted 11/29/2017 4:03:51 PM

Hi Folks,   You are familiar with URLs such as this:   http://www.example.org   That URL uses the http scheme.   There are other schemes in addition to the http scheme. One such scheme is the data URI scheme. Let’s look at it. But first, let’s motivate . . . Read full entry »


Re: Is a URI a uri or the entity pointed to by the uri?

Posted 11/28/2017 10:55:00 AM

I love it when we get all metaphysical!    Jim On 2017-11-27 11:57, Simon St.Laurent wrote: This conversation is a perfect response to the initial question.  xml-dev wins again! Thanks, Simon . . . Read full entry »


Re: Is a URI a uri or the entity pointed to by the uri?

Posted 11/27/2017 4:47:00 PM

On 27 Nov 2017, at 15:37, Costello, Roger L. <costello@mitre.org> wrote: Hi Folks,1. Here is a set:{The Amazon River, George Washington, 3}That set uses a name for each of its member, but the set consists of the objects named, not of the . . . Read full entry »


Is a URI a uri or the entity pointed to by the uri?

Posted 11/27/2017 3:37:45 PM

Hi Folks, 1. Here is a set: {The Amazon River, George Washington, 3} That set uses a name for each of its member, but the set consists of the objects named, not of the names themselves. In the set, the first president of the United States, whose name happens to be ‘George Washington’ . . . Read full entry »


Re: Is a URI a uri or the entity pointed to by the uri?

Posted 11/27/2017 1:57:45 PM

This conversation is a perfect response to the initial question.  xml-dev wins again! Thanks, Simon On 11/27/2017 1:43 PM, Webb Roberts wrote: But that would just be a performance of the song.  On Nov 27, 2017, . . . Read full entry »


Re: Is a URI a uri or the entity pointed to by the uri?

Posted 11/27/2017 1:43:40 PM

But that would just be a performance of the song. On Nov 27, 2017, at 13:40, John Cowan <johnwcowan@gmail.com> wrote:On Mon, Nov 27, 2017 at 1:37 PM, Webb Roberts <webb@w...> wrote:'Well, what IS the song, then?' said Alice, who was by this time co . . . Read full entry »


Re: Is a URI a uri or the entity pointed to by the uri?

Posted 11/27/2017 1:40:24 PM

On Mon, Nov 27, 2017 at 1:37 PM, Webb Roberts <webb@webbroberts.com> wrote:'Well, what IS the song, then?' said Alice, who was by this time completely bewildered. 'I was coming to that,' the Knight said. 'The song real . . . Read full entry »


Re: Is a URI a uri or the entity pointed to by the uri?

Posted 11/27/2017 1:37:34 PM

'You are sad,' the Knight said in an anxious tone: 'let me sing you a song to comfort you.' 'Is it very long?' Alice asked, for she had heard a good deal of poetry that day. 'It's long,' said the Knight, 'but very, VERY beautiful. Everybody that hears me sing it--either it brings the TEARS in . . . Read full entry »


Re: Is a URI a uri or the entity pointed to by the uri?

Posted 11/27/2017 10:33:12 AM

Your question can’t be answered as asked because you didn’t specify the *context* for the answer.In the case of the XML document, the value of the < attendee> element is the text node http://www.example.com/SallySmith (which we can generalize to the string http://www.example.com/SallySmith as . . . Read full entry »


Re: Is a URI a uri or the entity pointed to by the uri?

Posted 11/27/2017 9:27:36 AM

The W3C TAG discussed a related issue for some years; you may wish to peruse the archives. https://www.w3.org/2001/tag/issues.html#httpRange-14 Lauren On Mon, Nov 27, 2017 at 8:47 AM, Michael Kay <mike@saxonica.com> wrote: > > . . . Read full entry »


[ANN] Reminder: XML Prague 2018 - Call for Proposals

Posted 11/23/2017 5:39:57 PM

Hello, there are still seven days to submit your proposal for XML Prague. The XML Prague conference will include two full days of single track sessions, as well as a multitrack unconference day. The conference is held on the Thursday, Friday and Saturday (February 8-10, 2018), located at the Uni . . . Read full entry »


Re: A better way to construct regular expressions in XMLSchema

Posted 11/23/2017 1:36:58 PM

On 20.11.2017 13:35, Costello, Roger L. wrote: > I have an XML Schema that needs some complex regular expressions. I have been using <!ENTITY> to construct the regexes. See below. I find it pretty hard to debug these regular expressions. Is there a better way to construct regexes? /Roger . . . Read full entry »


Re: How efficient are XML parsers?

Posted 11/23/2017 1:32:14 PM

On 15.11.2017 13:07, Costello, Roger L. wrote: > Answer: Google FlatBuffers. Funny fact is that Facebook is now so large that right hand doesn't know what left was doing. They already have their own technology for more-efficient data interchange: https://thrift.apache.org/ But basically most . . . Read full entry »


Re: A better way to construct regular expressions in XMLSchema

Posted 11/21/2017 2:51:42 PM

On Mon, 2017-11-20 at 12:35 +0000, Costello, Roger L. wrote: > Hi Folks, > > I have an XML Schema that needs some complex regular expressions. I > have been using <!ENTITY> to construct the regexes. See below. I find > it pretty hard to debug these regular expressions. Is ther . . . Read full entry »


Re: RE: When maxOccurs=1 means an unbounded number ofoccurrenc

Posted 11/21/2017 1:58:16 PM

On 21 November 2017 at 13:47, Costello, Roger L. <costello@mitre.org> wrote: > Hi Folks, > > > > Here is more context to my post. I am reading the vCard RFC. > (https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc6350) The RFC specifies . . . Read full entry »


RE: When maxOccurs=1 means an unbounded number of occurrences isvalid

Posted 11/21/2017 1:47:37 PM

Hi Folks,   Here is more context to my post. I am reading the vCard RFC. (https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc6350)  The RFC specifies number of occurrences this way:       +-------------+--------------------------------------------------+     . . . Read full entry »


Re: A better way to construct regular expressions in XML Schem

Posted 11/21/2017 1:35:04 PM

s/data extraction/data abstraction/s/system anyone/system anyway/blushOn Tue, Nov 21, 2017 at 1:30 PM, Rick Jelliffe <rjelliffe@allette.com.au> wrote:But he doesn't want to do data extraction. He just wants to chunk up a large regular . . . Read full entry »


Re: A better way to construct regular expressions in XML Schem

Posted 11/21/2017 1:30:38 PM

But he doesn't want to do data extraction. He just wants to chunk up a large regular expression. We need to be careful about a degree of nanny-ism, that just prevents people from getting the job done. The sure result of refusing to provide (abusable) general mechanisms is an explosion of specif . . . Read full entry »


Re: When maxOccurs=1 means an unbounded number of occurrences

Posted 11/21/2017 11:27:35 AM

> On Nov 20, 2017, at 4:13 PM, yamahito <yamahito@gmail.com> wrote: > > Hi Roger, > > I would disagree only with your initial interpretation: I think minOccurs=1 - I think 'exactly' trumps 'MAY'. > > Interested to see if the lis . . . Read full entry »


Re: A better way to construct regular expressions in XML Schem

Posted 11/21/2017 10:24:01 AM

No.   But what makes entities offensive? Seems like the appropriate technology to use.In Schematron, you can put the text portions into variables and combine them. But it is ultimately still just text substitution (macros). XSD doesn't provide simple macros, but it doesn't need to, because . . . Read full entry »


Re: A better way to construct regular expressions in XML Schem

Posted 11/21/2017 1:05:54 AM

I've always been ambivalent about macros in general, largely because I've seen people use their power to build monstrous houses-built-on-sand that were wonderful to behold but impossible to understand or debug or change.I've also been very ambivalent about XML's macro mechanism (entity expansion), . . . Read full entry »


Re: When maxOccurs=1 means an unbounded number of occurrences

Posted 11/20/2017 11:17:51 PM

I would disagree only with your initial interpretation: I think minOccurs=1 - I think 'exactly' trumps 'MAY'.It struck me as being thoroughly ambiguous, but perhaps if we had more context it would become more clear.Michael KaySaxonicaThe RFC says that Name must occur *1 times, where *1 is defined a . . . Read full entry »


Re: When maxOccurs=1 means an unbounded number ofoccurrences i

Posted 11/20/2017 11:13:34 PM

Hi Roger,I would disagree only with your initial interpretation: I think minOccurs=1 - I think 'exactly' trumps 'MAY'.Interested to see if the list thinks differently!TomOn Mon, 20 Nov 2017 at 15:29 Costello, Roger L. <costello@mitre.o . . . Read full entry »


When maxOccurs=1 means an unbounded number of occurrences is valid

Posted 11/20/2017 3:27:33 PM

Hi Folks, I am reading a Request for Comments (RFC). The RFC says that Name must occur *1 times, where *1 is defined as “Exactly one instance MAY be present.” I interpret that to mean minOccurs=0 and maxOccurs=1. So, this is valid because there is only one occurrence: <Name>Bo . . . Read full entry »


A better way to construct regular expressions in XML Schemas?

Posted 11/20/2017 12:35:03 PM

Hi Folks,   I have an XML Schema that needs some complex regular expressions. I have been using <!ENTITY> to construct the regexes. See below. I find it pretty hard to debug these regular expressions. Is there a better way to construct regexes?  /Roger   <?xml version=&q . . . Read full entry »


Re: A better way to construct regular expressions in XMLSchema

Posted 11/20/2017 9:18:56 AM

This seems like a validation requirement better suited to Schematron or maybe custom code. I can’t think of a better way to manage the composition of this kind of complex regex within the source of an XSD schema. To debug it I’d probably do the debugging outside of the XSD content, e.g., . . . Read full entry »


Re: @xml-base in subtrees included (a) via entity expansion, a

Posted 11/16/2017 11:47:08 PM

> > Given that you are looking aside at the location information in order to > identify the correct base URI in case (B), I suspect that you would be > able to calculate the correct base URI in case C if you were to set feature > http://apache.org/xml/features/xinclude/fixup-base-u . . . Read full entry »


Re: @xml-base in subtrees included (a) via entityexpansion, an

Posted 11/16/2017 8:38:38 PM

The problem is that xerces team is looking for volunteers to publish a release with bug fixes that are quite old, and won't probably be able to add required extension property. Have a look at this post : https://mail-archives.apache.org/mod_mbox/xerces-j-dev/201711.mbox/browser Christophe Le . . . Read full entry »


Re: @xml-base in subtrees included (a) via entity expansion, a

Posted 11/16/2017 11:36:21 AM

> On Nov 16, 2017, at 1:42 AM, Michael Kay <mike@saxonica.com> wrote: >> ... >> >> (3) Your upstream processor is, as required by the spec, leaving xml:base attributes in the top-level included element items of a . . . Read full entry »


Re: @xml-base in subtrees included (a) via entity expansion, a

Posted 11/16/2017 8:42:40 AM

> Thanks for studying the problem. > I am not entirely certain that I understand the problem. But I infer from your posing the question that: > > (1) Saxon and not your upstream XML processor is taking responsibility for calculating the base URIs elements. > (2) Your upstream p . . . Read full entry »


Re: How efficient are XML parsers?

Posted 11/16/2017 12:20:12 AM

So FlatBuffers is to JSON what EXI is to XML?On Wed, Nov 15, 2017 at 11:59 PM, Michael Kay <mike@saxonica.com> wrote:A classic example of how you can nearly always improve performance by sacrificing something else, e.g. simplicity, or conformance to standards, or p . . . Read full entry »


Re: @xml-base in subtrees included (a) via entityexpansion, an

Posted 11/15/2017 9:21:49 PM

Perhaps resort to a configuration parameter? Such a setting (say "external-fragment-base-uri") with two possible values (say, fragment-root|fragment-parent) representing the "external entity way" versus the "xs:include" way? The default value of such a setting should probably be fragment-root, as t . . . Read full entry »


@xml-base in subtrees included (a) via entity expansion, and (b) via xi:

Posted 11/15/2017 5:29:00 PM

Patrik Stellman raised a problem on the saxon-help list for which I would appreciate advice. When an external entity is expanded, and the entity in question contains an element with an xml-base attribute, the value of the @xml:base attribute is supposed to be resolved against the base URI of the e . . . Read full entry »


Re: @xml-base in subtrees included (a) via entity expansion, a

Posted 11/15/2017 4:56:36 PM

> On Nov 15, 2017, at 2:21 PM, Hans-Juergen Rennau <hrennau@yahoo.de> wrote: > > Perhaps resort to a configuration parameter? Such a setting (say "external-fragment-base-uri") with two possible values (say, fragmen . . . Read full entry »


Re: How efficient are XML parsers?

Posted 11/15/2017 4:46:00 PM

> > I'm still hoping that EXI for JS will be a player. > Is there an EXI parser written in JS? Michael Kay Saxonica . . . Read full entry »


Re: How efficient are XML parsers?

Posted 11/15/2017 12:59:59 PM

A classic example of how you can nearly always improve performance by sacrificing something else, e.g. simplicity, or conformance to standards, or potential for change, or ease of writing an application to produce or consume the data.Just don't do it unless (a) you know you need the extra performan . . . Read full entry »


Re: How efficient are XML parsers?

Posted 11/15/2017 12:34:46 PM

On Wed, 2017-11-15 at 16:46 +0000, Michael Kay wrote: > > > > I'm still hoping that EXI for JS will be a player. > > > > Is there an EXI parser written in JS? Exificient, see http://exificient.github.io/ Liam > > Michael Kay > Saxonica > -- Liam Quin, W . . . Read full entry »


Re: How efficient are XML parsers?

Posted 11/15/2017 12:26:50 PM

"A JSON parser needs to build a field mapping before it can start parsing" I don't see how this is a requirement. It certainly is one approach a JSON parser can take, and one many do take; but I don't think it's necessary by any means. On Wed, Nov 15, 2017 at 7:07 AM, Costello, Roger . . . Read full entry »


How efficient are XML parsers?

Posted 11/15/2017 12:07:07 PM

Hi Folks,   I recently read an article about Facebook dumping JSON due to inadequate performance of JSON parsers. See below. I wonder how XML parsers would stack up. Do you have numbers?   Parse a 20KB stream Facebook requirement: must not exceed the UI frame refresh interval of 16.6 . . . Read full entry »


Re: How efficient are XML parsers?

Posted 11/15/2017 11:37:36 AM

On Wed, 2017-11-15 at 12:07 +0000, Costello, Roger L. wrote: > Hi Folks, > > I recently read an article about Facebook dumping JSON due to > inadequate performance of JSON parsers. See below. I wonder how XML > parsers would stack up. Do you have numbers? The fastest XML parsers ar . . . Read full entry »


Re: How efficient are XML parsers?

Posted 11/15/2017 8:10:41 AM

If you don't make Facebook's solutions your solutions then you won't make Facebook's problems your problem.On Wed, Nov 15, 2017 at 7:07 AM, Costello, Roger L. <costello@mitre.org> wrote: Hi Folks,   I recently read an article . . . Read full entry »


Re: Need a language whiz: An XML Schema "specifies" howdata is

Posted 11/14/2017 1:26:00 PM

An XML Schema describes certain document structures and data typing. The parties specify when, how and how much of it should be used.A schema has no agency or will or knowledge of outcomes or intent. It reveals/reflects the relative power and attitudes of the various stakeholders.RegardsRickOn 14 N . . . Read full entry »


Re: Need a language whiz: An XML Schema "specifies" howdata is

Posted 11/14/2017 11:33:46 AM

On 11/14/2017 10:42 AM, Eliot Kimber wrote: At the risk of splitting hairs (ok, at the certain risk of splitting hairs), I don’t think a schema can be said to “describe how data is to be structured”. Well, I was trying to see how close to the language of Roger's proposed statements as I could g . . . Read full entry »


Re: Need a language whiz: An XML Schema "specifies" howdata is

Posted 11/14/2017 9:42:43 AM

At the risk of splitting hairs (ok, at the certain risk of splitting hairs), I don’t think a schema can be said to “describe how data is to be structured”. Any declarative schema is simply a set of constraints to which instances governed by the schema do or don’t conform. Any descriptive aspect i . . . Read full entry »


Re: Need a language whiz: An XML Schema "specifies" howdata is

Posted 11/14/2017 7:43:54 AM

Or, to put it in language similar to Roger's 8 statements, 0. A schema describes how data is to be structured, and may be used to constrain that structure. TomP On 11/13/2017 9:26 PM, Rick Jelliffe wrote: An XML Schema describes certain document structures and data typing. The parties specify w . . . Read full entry »


Need a language whiz: An XML Schema "specifies" how data is to bestruct

Posted 11/13/2017 1:13:53 PM

Hi Folks,   Which of the following is most accurate and why?   An XML Schema specifies how data is to be structured. An XML Schema describes how data is to be structured. An XML Schema states how data is to be structured. An XML Schema constrains the structure of data. An XML Schema . . . Read full entry »


Re: Need a language whiz: An XML Schema "specifies" howdata is

Posted 11/13/2017 10:24:04 AM

"Constrains".On Mon, Nov 13, 2017 at 8:13 AM, Costello, Roger L. <costello@mitre.org> wrote: Hi Folks,   Which of the following is most accurate and why?   An XML Schema specifies how data is to be structured. An XML Schema . . . Read full entry »


Re: Need a language whiz: An XML Schema "specifies" howdata is

Posted 11/13/2017 9:47:06 AM

+1 --Eliot Kimberhttp://contrext.com   From: John Cowan <johnwcowan@gmail.com>Date: Monday, November 13, 2017 at 9:24 AMTo: "Costello, Roger L." <costello@m...>Cc: "xml-dev@l..." <xml-d . . . Read full entry »


Best Practice: Enumerating a set of items in XML Schema

Posted 11/10/2017 2:03:19 PM

Issue: You have a set of items that you wish to enumerate in your XML Schema. Should the items be enumerated using the enumeration facet or the pattern facet?   At the bottom of this message is an example of both approaches. The first uses the enumeration facet. The second uses the pattern . . . Read full entry »


Re: Enumerating a set of values using the pattern facetversus

Posted 11/10/2017 8:36:22 AM

On 9 November 2017 at 02:01, Eliot Kimber <ekimber@contrext.com> wrote:In addition, the enumeration markup allows binding of annotations to each item, whereas the pattern can only take a single annotation for the entire pattern. I hadn& . . . Read full entry »


Enumerating a set of values using the pattern facet versus theenumeratio

Posted 11/8/2017 6:18:43 PM

Hi Folks,   Below are two XML Schema element declarations. Both enumerate a set of values for the <type> element. The first uses the pattern facet to enumerate the set of values. The second uses the enumeration facet. Is there a reason to prefer one over the other? Or, are they iden . . . Read full entry »


Re: Enumerating a set of values using the pattern facetversus

Posted 11/8/2017 2:31:26 PM

In addition, the enumeration markup allows binding of annotations to each item, whereas the pattern can only take a single annotation for the entire pattern. In general, I would prefer the enumeration here because it is more granular. This is from  schema I maintain as part of the DITA fo . . . Read full entry »


Re: Enumerating a set of values using the pattern facetversus

Posted 11/8/2017 2:28:05 PM

I would not expect grammar-driven editors to be able to use the pattern to guide authoring but to always be able to use the enumeration. Cheers, E. --Eliot Kimberhttp://contrext.com   From: "Costello, Roger L." <costello@&# . . . Read full entry »


Re: Enumerating a set of values using the pattern facetversus

Posted 11/8/2017 1:27:35 PM

I prefer the enumeration facet, since it does not care about special regex characters.On Wed, Nov 8, 2017 at 1:18 PM, Costello, Roger L. <costello@mitre.org> wrote: Hi Folks,   Below are two XML Schema element declarations. Both enumerate a set o . . . Read full entry »


[ANN] Release of XMLmind Word To XML v1.3

Posted 11/8/2017 10:25:01 AM

Release of XMLmind Word To XML v1.3. Highlights: - Many enhancements and bug fixes. - Now available as a macOS X native .dmg distribution including a private Java[tm] 1.8.0_152 runtime. More information in http://www.xmlmind.com/w2x/changes.html ---------------------------- What is XMLmind W . . . Read full entry »


Re: XPath expression which checks that all commas are escaped

Posted 11/6/2017 5:10:47 PM

You could also use an ebnf grammar with something like the rex parser in your schematron rule: see e.g. Kirk a’s paper from XML London this year*, or some of Stephen Pemberton’s talks that it references * video: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=0hhquUmsKf0paper: p56 of http://xmllondon.com/2017/xmllon . . . Read full entry »


RE: XPath expression which checks that all commas areescaped

Posted 11/3/2017 9:10:40 PM

Michael Kay wrote: > I suspect that there must only be one > backslash before the comma: if there > are two ("\\,") then the comma is not > escaped because the "\\" represents > a real backslash. Wow! I had not thought about that. > not(matches(replace(., . . . Read full entry »


Re: XPath expression which checks that all commas are escaped

Posted 11/3/2017 9:02:41 PM

> On 3 Nov 2017, at 19:22, Dimitre Novatchev <dnovatchev@gmail.com> wrote: > >> not(contains(replace(., '\\,', ''), ',')) > > And, of course: > > not(matches(., '[^\\],')) > I don't think that detects an unescaped co . . . Read full entry »


XPath expression which checks that all commas are escaped

Posted 11/3/2017 6:40:53 PM

Hi Folks, Do you deal with Request for Comments (RFCs)? Then the following might come in handy someday. Note: Thanks to Martin Honnen for helping me with the XPath expression (below). Some RFCs (e.g., vCard) have this rule:             &nb . . . Read full entry »


Re: XPath expression which checks that all commas are escaped

Posted 11/3/2017 12:22:50 PM

> not(contains(replace(., '\\,', ''), ',')) And, of course: not(matches(., '[^\\],')) Cheers, Dimitre On Fri, Nov 3, 2017 at 12:14 PM, Dimitre Novatchev <dnovatchev@gmail.com> wrote: > not(contains(replace(., '\\,', ''), ',')) > > On Fri, . . . Read full entry »


Re: XPath expression which checks that all commas are escaped

Posted 11/3/2017 12:14:51 PM

not(contains(replace(., '\\,', ''), ',')) On Fri, Nov 3, 2017 at 11:40 AM, Costello, Roger L. <costello@mitre.org> wrote: > Hi Folks, > > Do you deal with Request for Comments (RFCs)? Then the following might come > . . . Read full entry »


Expat 2.2.5 released

Posted 11/1/2017 8:01:57 PM

Hi everyone, Expat 2.2.5 has been released. It fixes miscellaneous bugs. For more details, please check the changelog [1]. If you maintain Expat packaging or a bundled version of Expat somewhere, please update it to 2.2.5. Thanks! Best Sebastian [1] https://github.com/libexpat/libexpat/blo . . . Read full entry »


Re: Is this a good use of XML: XML-formatted images?

Posted 10/30/2017 12:02:04 PM

On Sun, 29 Oct 2017 13:01:22 +0000, "Costello, Roger L." <costello@mitre.org> wrote: | Thoughts? RFC 3252. . . . Read full entry »


Re: Is this a good use of XML: XML-formatted images?

Posted 10/29/2017 5:51:08 PM

On 29 Oct 2017, at 13:01, Costello, Roger L. <costello@mitre.org> wrote: Hi Folks,JPEG/JFIF, GIF, PNG, BMP are, as you know, binary data formats for images.Why are there no XML-formatted images? Is XML not a good format for images? If it’s not, why . . . Read full entry »


Re: Is this a good use of XML: XML-formatted images?

Posted 10/29/2017 3:00:56 PM

Raster images are  one of the types types of image elements SVG supportshttps://www.w3.org/TR/SVG11/render.html#TypesOfGraphicsElementsOn Sun, Oct 29, 2017 at 10:56 AM Costello, Roger L. <costello@mitre.org> wrote: Thanks Timothy.   I was thinkin . . . Read full entry »


RE: Is this a good use of XML: XML-formatted images?

Posted 10/29/2017 2:55:57 PM

Thanks Timothy.   I was thinking bitmapped images, not vector images.   /Roger   From: Timothy Cook [mailto:timothywayne.cook@gmail.com] Sent: Sunday, October 29, 2017 10:25 AM To: Cos . . . Read full entry »


Is this a good use of XML: XML-formatted images?

Posted 10/29/2017 1:01:22 PM

Hi Folks, JPEG/JFIF, GIF, PNG, BMP are, as you know, binary data formats for images. Why are there no XML-formatted images? Is XML not a good format for images? If it’s not, why not? I’ll speculate: perhaps the reason is simply that XML is too verbose. Is that the reason? Are there . . . Read full entry »


Re: Is this a good use of XML: XML-formatted images?

Posted 10/29/2017 12:25:29 PM

Maybe you have heard of this?"This specification defines the features and syntax for Scalable Vector Graphics (SVG) Version 1.1, a modularized language for describing two-dimensional vector and mixed vector/raster graphics in XML."https://www.w3.org/TR/SVG11/On Sun, Oct 29, 2017 at 11:01 . . . Read full entry »


Re: XML-formatted data can be incrementally enriched with more

Posted 10/28/2017 8:48:43 PM

The ability to extend a data format while retaining backwards compatibility is important, and was no doubt one of the objectives of the design of XML.But I don't think that's primarily what the "extensibility" property is about. The "X" in "XML" is there primarily to contrast with HTML, and it refe . . . Read full entry »


RE: XML-formatted data can be incrementally enriched with more andmore i

Posted 10/28/2017 7:10:23 PM

Hi Folks,   Thank you (again) for your outstanding responses.   I found your responses surprising. In a nutshell, you told me that many, if not most, data formats – both text and binary – are extensible.   XML, it seems to me, has always made it a point to advertise t . . . Read full entry »


Re: XML-formatted data can be incrementally enriched withmore

Posted 10/28/2017 1:38:34 PM

Hi Roger, > Lesson Learned: XML is the only data format that supports incremental enrichment. At first I thought that what you describe is related to strong vs. weak vs. no typing, late binding and so on It is related to some extent, however extensibility can be achieved in a standard way ev . . . Read full entry »


Re: XML-formatted data can be incrementally enriched with more

Posted 10/27/2017 7:46:23 PM

You can do it with CSV: just add fields to the right-hand end of a line P On 27 October 2017 14:33:59 Michael Kay <mike@saxonica.com> wrote: Do you agree with those assertions? No. We were doing this with binary type-length-value formats . . . Read full entry »


Re: XML-formatted data can be incrementally enriched with more

Posted 10/27/2017 2:31:36 PM

Do you agree with those assertions? No. We were doing this with binary type-length-value formats 50 years ago.Michael KaySaxonica . . . Read full entry »


XML-formatted data can be incrementally enriched with more and moreinfor

Posted 10/27/2017 12:18:08 PM

Hi Folks,   Assertion: The XML data format is the only data format that lends itself to incremental enrichment.   Assertion: If data is to traverse through a workflow and you want the data to be incrementally enriched along the way, then you must format the data as XML.   Do yo . . . Read full entry »


Re: XML-formatted data can be incrementally enriched withmore

Posted 10/27/2017 8:45:43 AM

On Fri, Oct 27, 2017 at 8:18 AM, Costello, Roger L. <costello@mitre.org> wrote: Suppose the data is binary. For example, suppose the data is a JPEG file. How would you incrementally enrich JPEG files? How would you bundle together mu . . . Read full entry »


Re: DSDL.org

Posted 10/25/2017 10:01:05 PM

The webarchive of the original DSDL.org is available at https://web.archive.org/web/20160122193526/http://dsdl.orgRegards,Makoto2017/10/25 午後6:38 "yamahito" <yamahito@gmail.com>:I note that the above website is now a norwegian bl . . . Read full entry »


DSDL.org

Posted 10/25/2017 9:38:17 AM

I note that the above website is now a norwegian blog extolling the values of playing online slots.Does/will DSDL have a new home?The webmaster for nvdl.org might also like to know so that he can edit/remove the link on that page. . . . Read full entry »


[ANN] XML Prague 2018 - Call for Proposals

Posted 10/23/2017 2:00:58 PM

Hello, we are glad to announce that call for proposals for XML Prague 2018 conference is open now. The XML Prague conference will include two full days of single track sessions, as well as a multitrack unconference day. The conference is held on the Thursday, Friday and Saturday (February 8-10, . . . Read full entry »


[ANN] Release of XMLmind XSL-FO Converter v5.4.6

Posted 10/23/2017 10:09:19 AM

Release of XMLmind XSL-FO Converter v5.4.6. Highlights: - XMLmind XSL Utility and XMLmind XSL Server can now be used to convert DocBook v5.1 assemblies to PDF, RTF, WML, DOCX and ODT. - Updated some software components in XMLmind XSL Utility and XMLmind XSL Server. More information in http://w . . . Read full entry »


Re: [ANN] XML Prague 2018 - Call for Proposals

Posted 10/22/2017 8:26:15 PM

On 22/10/17 15:00, Jirka Kosek wrote: > we are glad to announce that call for proposals for XML Prague 2018 > conference is open now. I have updated the entry in the FAQ at http://xml.silmaril.ie/moreinfo.html#events ///Peter Attachment: signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signatur . . . Read full entry »


[ANN] XML Prague 2018 - Call for Proposals

Posted 10/22/2017 4:00:50 PM

Hello, we are glad to announce that call for proposals for XML Prague 2018 conference is open now. The XML Prague conference will include two full days of single track sessions, as well as a multitrack unconference day. The conference is held on the Thursday, Friday and Saturday (February 8-10, . . . Read full entry »


RE: NVDL & ISO Schematron?

Posted 10/18/2017 12:17:16 PM

Hi,   We use Jing to do NVDL and Schematron validation. There is basic ISO Schematron support but there are things you cannot do – for instance if your Schematron uses queryBinding="xslt2" and contains XSL elements, it will not work. We forked the project to add the ful . . . Read full entry »


editors and schemas

Posted 10/18/2017 11:29:30 AM

This might interest the document-centric folks here: ProseMirror: A toolkit for building rich-text editors on the Web http://prosemirror.net/ In particular, the sections describing ProseMirror's schemas and transformations might seem familiar, but not very familiar: http://prosemirror.net/docs/ . . . Read full entry »


NVDL & ISO Schematron?

Posted 10/18/2017 10:34:42 AM

What would people currently recommend to do NVDL validation including standalone schematron?It looks like the current version of Jing from github has some degree of support, but documentation doesn’t mention it explicitly; can anyone enlighten as to what support is offered, or if there are any alte . . . Read full entry »


Re: PE's in internal subset with non-validating processors

Posted 10/17/2017 11:48:37 AM

Parameter entities can also be declared in an internal declaration, right?  That could be thought of as parsing rather than validation, IMO...On Mon, 16 Oct 2017 at 01:25 David John Burrowes <biede0@gmail.com> wrote:Thank you John Cowan a . . . Read full entry »


Re: PE's in internal subset with non-validating processors

Posted 10/17/2017 4:54:02 AM

> Parameter entities can also be declared in an internal declaration, right? Yes.> That could be thought of as parsing rather than validation, IMO…I’m not quite sure i understand what you mean.  But a non-validating parser can indeed parse a PE declaration if it chooses, and do noth . . . Read full entry »


Re: PE's in internal subset with non-validating processors

Posted 10/15/2017 6:12:15 PM

On Sun, Oct 15, 2017 at 3:18 PM, David John Burrowes <biede0@gmail.com> wrote:The phrase "and in any parameter entity that they read” is what is puzzling me.  Yes, it probably should have been "any parameter entity that they choose to rea . . . Read full entry »


Re: PE's in internal subset with non-validating processors

Posted 10/15/2017 5:25:29 PM

Thank you John Cowan and Tim Bray for your swift responses!DavidOn Oct 15, 2017, at 3:12 PM, John Cowan <johnwcowan@gmail.com> wrote:On Sun, Oct 15, 2017 at 3:18 PM, David John Burrowes <biede0@g...> wrote:The phrase "and in any parameter entity that they re . . . Read full entry »


Re: PE's in internal subset with non-validating processors

Posted 10/15/2017 1:37:58 PM

We'll, even a non-validating processor *might* decide to read parameter entities. Nothing forbids it.On Oct 15, 2017 12:18 PM, "David John Burrowes" <biede0@gmail.com> wrote:I have a question about a passage in section 5.1 of the XML standard that . . . Read full entry »



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