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Re: [offtopic] Re: SQL instead of XQuery

• From: Dmitry Turin <dev3os@n...>
• To: xml-dev@l...
• Date: Wed, 6 Feb 2008 14:42:28 +0200

Andrzej,

>> Usage of XQuery for processing of xml-data in DBMS
>> is practically equal to existence of second, foreign query language.
>> I propose to use SQL instead of it - let me introduce my view in
>> http://sql50.euro.ru/sql5.ppt (707 Kb, slides #31-47).
>> Accepting this proposals, we get smoothness between rational and xml.

AJT> There are a
AJT> lot of good reasons to store XML in an XML-based DBMS.

Speach goes about query language on slides,
instead of algorithms of engine.

AJT> 3) The XRX stack (XForms ...

First, XForms itself is very bad for non-programmers (checked).
Details are on the
http://html60.euro.ru/site/html60/en/author/quest_eng.htm

AJT> ... /REST/XQuery)

Second, XQuery is worse, than SQL/XLang, as
procedural language is worse declarative language.
So expenses of job/time for XQuery is more.

AJT> is a very powerful set ...              [[reason, why is offtopic]]

Word ('powerful'), which means nothing.
Creterias are necessary instead of it.

AJT> ... of technologies to develop ...

Non-programmer is not capable to develop inside these technologies.
All are said by this.

AJT> ... and deploy ...

Non-programmers can't deploy gasket (php, perl, their libraries)
or adjust and use bridge (Web server of DBMS) between DBMS and browser.
All are said by this.

My proposal removes this gasket.

AJT> ... complex applications about an order of magnitude faster
AJT> (both in dev and maint time)
AJT>  than even the latest of dyanamic languages.

We look into question with avarage user,
now let's look at professional programmer.
How is deployment of gasket (or usual writing of gasket) is
faster, than non-doing this ??

AJT> SQL does not fill the same role as does XQuery.

Grammatical time is messed up: not 'fill', but 'filled'.

P.S. SQL/XLang fill.

AJT> 4) The slide deck is atrocious.  Go visit the Presentation Zen web site/blog
AJT> and redo the whole thing from scratch.  Please don't inflict those slides on
AJT> anyone.

Give links to presentation of sophisticated ideas,
which (presentation) is better, then my one.
I'd like to compare.

AJT> 5) XLang?  That went the way of the dodo a long time ago.

'dodo' ?
Clarify, please.

AJT> 6) I think the comparison of XQuery to SQL is
AJT> apples/oranges.  Nonsensical, in a word.

Arguments are necessary (as always).

AJT> But the idea of extending SQL to understand XPath constructs for
AJT> where clauses and such does have some merit for when using a hybrid XML/RDBMS
AJT> data store.

SQL/XLang is created for this hybrid
(and to move application from pure rational engine to pure xml engine
and vice verse).

AJT> 7) Sounds like an academic approach, that has little understanding of the
AJT> real world of application construction and maintenance.

You mess up 'little understanding' and 'little similarity'.

I even was not going to be a similar,
i was going to be usefull for real user
(instead 'for real world of constructions').


Dmitry Turin
HTML6     (6. 5.3)  http://html60.euro.ru
SQL5      (5.11.0)  http://sql50.euro.ru
Unicode7  (7. 2.1)  http://unicode70.euro.ru
Computer2 (2. 0.2)  http://computer20.euro.ru

• References:
  • SQL instead of XQuery
    • From: Dmitry Turin <dev3os@n...>
  • Re: SQL instead of XQuery
    • From: "Andrzej Jan Taramina" <andrzej@c...>