[XML-DEV Mailing List Archive Home] [By Thread] [By Date] [Recent Entries] [Reply To This Message] Re: ISO and the Standards Golden Hammer (was Re: You
I neglected to provide requisite bibliographic information for the (cited) SGML FAQ Book, in case anyone needs it: http://www.oasis-open.org/cover/deroseFAQ-TOC.html http://www.oasis-open.org/cover/deroseFAQ-DES.html Derose, Steven J. The SGML FAQ Book: Understanding the Foundation of HTML and XML. [Kluwer Academic] Electronic Publishing Series, Number 7. Dordrecht/Boston: Kluwer Academic Publishers, [July] 1997. Extent: xxiv + 250 pages, appendices. ISBN: 0-7923-9943-9 (Hardbound). Author's affiliation: Inso Corporation, formerly Electronic Book Technologies, Inc. Another excellent source of information (though not the desired "note") is of course, the SGML Handbook, edited by Charles Goldfarb. It contains a fair amount of commentary of this sort: "The original idea behind the CONCUR feature was to allow the results of one or more formatting processes to coexist [...] I therefore recommend that CONCUR not be used to create multiple logical views of a document, such as verse-oriented and speech-oriented views of poetry..." Of course, this is just the recollection and interpretation of one person, reflecting upon and rethinking 1980-vintage decisions in 1990, but Goldfarb is the key person. Goldfarb, Charles F. The SGML Handbook. Edited and with a foreword by Yuri Rubinsky. Oxford: Oxford University Press, 1990. Extent: 688 pages. ISBN: 0-19-853737-1. This volume contains the full annotated text of ISO 8879 (with amendments) and complete commentary on the SGML standard by its major architect and editor. http://xml.coverpages.org/goldfarbTOC.html http://www.oup.co.uk/isbn/0-19-853737-9 ----------------------------------------------------- Robin Cover XML Cover Pages WWW: http://xml.coverpages.org Newsletter: http://xml.coverpages.org/newsletter.html Innodata Isogen: rcover@i... OASIS: robin.cover@o... On Fri, 30 Apr 2004, Robin Cover wrote: > On Fri, 30 Apr 2004 jcowan@r... wrote: > > > Robin Cover scripsit: > > > > > Are you forgetting about some of the > > > untested SGML 'FEATURES' that got into ISO 8879, and by common > > > consent (from my POV) represent engineering monstrosities? > > > > Something I'd like to see: a historical note explaining the features of > > SGML that didn't make it into XML, particularly focused on what they were > > intended to be used for. > > I'm not sure this note will ever be written, as it would likely not be > flattering to any of the people who deserve credit for making the > core ideas of SGML a success. Read between the lines in Steve DeRose's > SGML FAQ Book, and read (twice) through the postings of Erik Naggum > to comp.text.sgml, and ask some of the people who witnessed the ISO > process at work in the final months before 8879 became cast in steel. > > I could write what I think I know about this, but I don't think it > would serve any interest other than historical, and it would represent > disproportionate focus on a part of the story that's not so pretty. > One example: we know a lot about the 'CONCUR' problem (some > refs at http://xml.coverpages.org/hierarchies.html ) but the experts > I know will tell you that the SGML CONCUR feature did not solve the > "real" concur problem, and arguably, not even the problem it tried > to solve, because of ambiguities [things not/under-specified] in the > standard. > > My intent was not to discredit the 8879 Standard, nor to discredit > the principal designers (most of whom were not formally trained > computer scientists, as has often been observed), but to offer one > small example showing how the ISO process itself does not guarantee > QA. That's important if the notion of "guaranteeing a better chance" > is fundamentally and profoundly non-determinative. > > Robin > > > > -- > > "May the hair on your toes never fall out!" John Cowan > > --Thorin Oakenshield (to Bilbo) jcowan@r... > > > > > ----------------------------------------------------------------- > The xml-dev list is sponsored by XML.org <http://www.xml.org>, an > initiative of OASIS <http://www.oasis-open.org> > > The list archives are at http://lists.xml.org/archives/xml-dev/ > > To subscribe or unsubscribe from this list use the subscription > manager: <http://www.oasis-open.org/mlmanage/index.php> > >
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